A Little Help Guide for Specing a PC with FAQ

Sleinous

Author Level
OK so i've come up with a rather cunning plan to cut down on the amount of typing I have to do on here.

I've written this post purely so I can link anyone's desktop query to this page and just tell them which section to look under for advice.

I'll be constantly updating this when new stuff comes out or as I learn more. Each colour of text represents contributions by a certain member, please check teh key below.

Key:

Sleinous
Nemesis

Please note that at the moment i'm only referring to Intel and Nvidia, my next step will be to learn a bit about the ATI card so I can slot them into my ROUGH order of performance.

Please also note that i've left out the Xeon's as I have zilch knowledge on the subject for the time being.

Section 1 - Hardware

i) CPU

Nowadays the CPU isn't everything to do with a computer but it still shouldn't be overlooked. The CPU family is just as important as the frequency it runs at. For example, an Intel Atom @ 1.66Ghz won't be anywhere near as powerful as an Intel Pentium 4 @ 1.66Ghz.

Celeron and Pentium Dual Cores

Both of these two CPUs are very cheap and ideal for a general purpose computer (web browsing, photo management, file storage, word processing, video viewing, etc) The pentium cpu was only £16 more (at time of writing) so i'd suggest going for this family whatever the use you plan on putting this computer through as it will give you that little bit more performance for a tiny amount more.

Core 2 Duo and Core 2 Quad

You can use any of these CPUs for mid-level gaming if you're restricted by a budget and you will still be left with a decent computer as long as you pair it up with a powerful enough GPU. You shouldn't experience any 'bottlenecks' with these families. If you do, Gorman will be the one to beat as he disagrees ;)

The Core 2 Duo's are also fine for the same uses as the Celeron and Pentium processors but will just give you a slightly more responsive experience (as long as the HDD also matches the spec). The E7600/E8400/E8500 would be ideal CPUs for this kind of spec with the E7600 costing roughly £40 more than the Pentium CPU (at time of writing).

Core i3s i5s and i7s

If you're building an HTPC (home theatre PC) then you can quite easily get away with a dual core Atom CPU but, it depends on what you intend to use it for. If you're doing a bit of video editing ro something like that, then you will want something like an i3 550/560 or even an i5 650/660 as most miniPCs dont have the room for a proper dedicated GPU (nor the PSU requirement) so most of your editing will run through your CPU rather than on a dedicated GPU as your motherboard will have some form of integrated chipset on it.

If you're more into having a standard desktop pc, and will be using it for light gaming, programming of some sort, video editing or transcoding, folding or other cpu intensive tasks you'd be better off looking at the higher end cpus in this new family like the i5 760 or i7 870/880. All these CPUs are quad core, with the top end i5 being the only quad core in that sub-family.

If you want long-lasting technology, high-end gaming, or just a machine that will be running 24/7 folding / other cpu intensive task then you may want to look at the top of the range, that is, all the i7 900s. The 970 and 980X are the only two CPus to currently offer 6 cores hwoever you'd be better off going for an i7 950 or 960 if you aren't planning on running software such as folding@home thatw ill make proper use of all the cores and threads. This is mainly because those 2 top end CPus cost a horrific amount!

Sandy Bridge

These are the new core i5s and core i7s, if you want an overclocked system chose a K series cpu as it has an unlocked multiplier HOWEVER, if you dont know what it is or how to overclock, stick to teh regular ediiton as this is the IDENTICAL chip. Only difference is the K series has that unlocked multiplier which just makes it far easier to overclock the CPU. For example a i7 2600K is the same as the i7 2600. (Note this also applies to the older K edition i5s and i7s but the numbering is a little more confusing, e.g the i7 875K is the same chip as the i7 870).

The i7 2600K will outperform the i7 980X in gaming as very few games use a 6 core setup as of yet.
The i7 2600 range is a quad-core CPU and will perform better than the i7 950, i7 960 etc.
The sandy bridge chipset has a built in graphics adapter on teh CPU die. P67 has no IGP pass thru and can OC, H67 has IGP pass thru and cannot OC. The H models are so you can use the on-chip gpu. You cannot use it if you have the P model. If you are going to be using a discrete card though, it is better to get a P model board.

ii) Motherboard

Expansion Slots

The PCS configurator will check everything for you to make sure every GPU / network card / USB interface card etc will fit but you can always double check by finidng an image of your motherboard then checking which expansion slots will be free once the computer is entirely built.

Some common things to take into account are that all the new Nvidia Fermi (400 series) GPus are dual width, that is, they will hide the expansion slot directly below the PCIe x16 slot that they are plugged into.

This means you need to be careful what extras you buy for your pc so that you dont end up with something you have no available slots to plug it into. It's also worth noting that a PCIe x4 device can fit into a PCIe x4/x8 and x16 slot. The same applies for PCIe x1 (x1/x4/x8/x16) and so on, but obviously, you cant but a PCIe x16 graphics card in a PCIe x1 expansion slot.

WLAN cards can be bought as the PCIe x1 or PCI standard now which should give us more flexibility in chosing where to place them incase one of the two ports is blocked up due to a dual-width GPU.

pciex16.png


pci.png


pciex4.png


If you have an older motherboard and wish to keep it (or indeed buy a much cheaper motherboard) and it only has x8 bandwidth as opposed to x16 (not to be confused with x8 sized expansion slots) then you should NOT experience too much of a loss in performance when using a mid-level gaming GPU such as a GTS 450 or GTX 460.

Internal USB Headers

Again, the PCS configurator will prevent you from adding a 52in1 card reader (for example) if your motherboard has no free internal USB headers left due to the "MIN 2 FRONT USB PORTS" under the USB Options tab.

A common issue is with teh ASUS Rampage III Extreme motherboard as it only has one header on the board. In this case, if you chose a case with 4 front USBs (such as the HAF 932) then only 2 USBs will work. To solve this little issue you can purchase an "NZXT IU01 Expansion Module" from here: http://www.kustompcs.co.uk/acatalog/info_3418.html

When chosing your motherboard, you also need to decide whether you want to have the ability to add another graphics card in SLI (Nvidia) or Crossfire (ATI) with the first card. If you do, then you will need a motherboard with atleast 2x PCIe x16 slots and that is SLI and/or Crossfire capable.

If you do NOT, then you can go for one of the cheaper boards, save yourself some money, and maybe but it towards a better GPU/CPU/PSU or something else.

iii) RAM

Intel states somewhere that their latest X58 chipset is designed for 800 mhz and 1066 mhz RAM, however, it is perfectly possible to install 1333Mhz, 1600Mhz, and 2000Mhz RAM onto your motherboard. Just make sure XMP is enabled in BIOS settings.

Generally, the Samsung 1333Mhz RAM is more stable for general purpose, word processing, light gaming etc

If you're doing serious video editing, an avid gamer etc you mayw ant the 1600Mhz, if you want to get the best of the best then I guessthe 2000 Dominator is for you.

iv) GPU

There's 4 GPUs to chose from if you're just using your pc for home or office use, watching videos, or playing low-end games with the GTS 450 being the best of those 4 and only slightly less powerful than the GTX 460.

The geForce 210 should only be speced if you're not doing any gaming, apart from tetris or something lol. It will still play videos etc etc.

If you have a little more to spend, a GT220 or 240 will allow you to play some of those classics like AoE 3 etc etc. Even some more modern games like Cod4 but not on max settings.

GTX 400 Series

The GTX 460 768MB is a good all-rounder for gaming. It really depends on your budget. I'd tend to avoid buying 2 460s in SLI as you can buy 1 470 for a similar price tag, and similar (but slightly less performance). However, the advantage then is that you can add a second 470 in SLI in a year or so time for much less than if you had bought both at the start. If you want extreme gaming then the 480 is for you. But most of what the 480 breezes through, the 470 ALSO breezes through.

If you're using CUDA enabled software such as photoshop, or (I hope soon for the 400 series cards) Badaboom media converter then an Nvidia card will be a plus compared to an ATI card as obviously teh ATI cards lack the CUDA tech.

If you're doing professional video editing, consider going for a Quadro card instead as this excels in 2d design rather than 3d design. (Gaming GPUs like the 400 series focus on 3d tech with not so much 2d tech inside the card).

You'll also want to ask Gorman for tips on Quadro setups as he's way more clued up on all this.
 
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Sleinous

Author Level
The GTX 460 comes in 3 variants. The most expenisve (the 2GB video RAM model) may well come in handy further down the land in game development but for now is a bit overkill, instead you can get a GTX 465 for slighty less, that has another 30 odd extra CUDA cores over the 460.

The 1GB 460 is the same as the 768MB 460, just has that extra video RAM. Consider going for a 1GB GTX 460 if you have a monitor that supports a high resolution, e.g. 1920x1080 and is 22"-23" or larger.The 2GB GTX 460 is slightly overclocked compared to the 1Gb and 768MB variants.

The 1GB GTS 450 is a great mainstream card wih 196 stream processors, and a 400W PSU requirement to run (400W includes all other system components, its not 400W for the card alone!!). Chose this kind of card if you're aiming for a computer in the £700 budget.

GTX 500 Series

The GTX 500 series comprises of GTX 570 and 580 right now, with the 560 and GTS 550 due soon (along with a dual-GPU GTX 590 made by EVGA and not Nvidia).

If you were planning on a 480, plan on the 1536MB 580 instead as it is basically what the 1st gen of Fermi cards was meant to be. Full set of 16 SM's (last one implemeneted in teh 580). bringing a total of 512 stream processors (CUDA cores). Consider this card if you want an extreme computer thatw ont be stopped by anything in the next 2 years.

The 1280MB GTX 570 has 480 CUDA cores and just about outperforms the old 480 so even if you want what the 480 used to offer, you should still be going for the cheaper 570!

The 500 series has a vapour chamber incporporated in teh heatsink now, it makes for a really quiet operation. Watxch some youtube vids from LinusTechTips comparing the idle fan speed on teh 480 and 580, its tremendous, you cant even hear the 580.

I use a EVGA GTX 580 SuperClocked Edition and even at 100% load folding@home with a 9800GT right below it blocking most of the fan intake, it only ramps up to 65%, compared to my old GTX 470 which ramped up to 100% and would get as hot as 90-94deg...

v) HDDs and SSDs

My favourite topic... as Meds will tell you.

If you want the very best, go for a Solid State Drive, but ONLY if you havethe cash to splash as these things are really not cost efficient atm.

If you want a regular mechanical drive, try to always go for a 64mb cached version, such as the 1TB WD10EARS or the 1TB WD1002FAEX. There exists a 640GB model for if you do not require a full TB of storage. The second one is 6gb/s the first, 3gb/s. There is next to NO difference between the two apart from in a few isolated read/write instances according to tests carried out on the two. 6gb/s standard is really only beneficial for your solid state drive.

If you have a budget to stick to butd ont want to cut back on anything else AND want a solid state drive, consider going for one of these drives and then buy the solid state drive later on in teh future when they start to drop down as manufacturing costs drop.

Lastly, you can go down the velociraptor route, faster than the WD Caviars, less cache but more revolutions per minute (10000 RPM compared to 7200 RPM on standard HDDs). This is more important than cache and therefore even though they only have 16mb cache, will outpefrom the WD Caviars as programs and boot times will be decreased more than theyw ould be on a Caviar with a larger cache. If you can't afford to go for a Velociraptor, getting a drive with a very large cache is the next best thing, as a drive with very little cache will tend to load programs slower than one with a larger cache. It will also take much longer to copy MANY small files to disc.

vi) PSU

The PCS configurator will stop you if you try to spec a pc with too weak a PSU but you also need to take into account whether or not you want to add a second graphics card into your system as that is quite a heavy wattage requirement. Most other upgrades will not affect the PSU as they are quit minimal, even a CPU upgrade, because you take one out and put a new one in so the extra wattage required wont be phenominal as you're limited by what CPU you can chose due to teh socket type on your motherboard, unless you changed that too.

The PSU is one of the most annoying things to upgrade for me. All those cables can get quite frustrating so I try to get the best ill need for a very long while and future proof it as much as possible.

If you have an existing dceent PSU with no dedicated PCIe power outputs, then you can use the 2x molex to 1x PCie power adapter to provide one of the 2 necessary power additions to most new GPUs. You will have to buy a second one or hopefully plug in a PCIe power cable in to the second slot before the card will work. Even most older PSUs have atleast one PCIe connector. Its usually when you need 2 you run into problems which is why most new GPUs give you a molex to PCIe adapter.

Rough Guide to PSU Requirements for Different 2x SLI Setups

NOTE: Each PSU has been based on the 2 GPUs + the following: an Intel i7 950, an ASUS P6TX58D-E, 6GB of Kingston HyperX 1600MHZ RAM, and a 1TB WD1002FAEX Black drive (uses mroe power than the green). Therefore, if you're specing an SLI with an i5 for example, you may be able to get away with a slightly weaker PSU. This is just a rough guide on what you should be chosing.

Please also note that if you spec an ASUS Rampage 3 mothrboard, you will need an ATX12V V2.3 power supply so you will be forced to chose the HX1000W, AX1200W or teh Thermaltake 1500W PSU

2x GTS 450

600W Quiet 80+
Corsair TX650W

2x 768MB GTX 460

Corsair TX750W

2x 1GB GTX 460

Corsair TX750W

2x 2GB GTX 460

Corsair TX750W

2x 1GB GTX 465

800W Quiet 80+
Corsair TX850W

2x GTX 470

Corsair TX850W
1010W Quiet 80+
Corsair HX1000W

2x GTX 480

Corsair HX1000W
Corsair AX1200W

2x HD5570

450W Quiet 80+
600W Quiet 80+

2x HD5670

600W Quiet 80+
Corsair TX650W

2x HD5750

600W Quiet 80+
Corsair TX650W

2x HD5770

600W Quiet 80+
Corsair TX650W

2x HD5830

600W Quiet 80+
Corsair TX650W

2x HD5850

Corsair TX750W

2x HD5870

Corsair TX750W
800W Quiet 80+
Corsair TX850W

2x HD5970

Corsair HX1000W
Corsair AX1200W

What I need now is someone a little more knowledgeable about ATI to tell me where each card would slot into this list of GPUs.

210 / GT220 / GT240 / GTS 450 / 768MB GTX 460 / 1GB GTX 460 / 2GB GTX 460 ~ GTX 465 (depending on intended usage the 460 could be a better option) / GTX 470 / GTX 480 / HD5970

I know the obvious one and ive already included that.

Note: Any errors or improvements, feel free to post them.

If you find a particular section of this useful, just rep it rather than reping my post that led you to this.
 
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Nemesis

Moderator
Moderator
Very good read Sleinous +rep for you my boy,
surprised the HDD section wasn't longer LOL!!!
Wouldn't you say that the choice of GFX card is down to the resolution of the screen aswell for instance where the 1GB 460 will perform better?

also the 8x/8x sli isnt a massive dent on the performance as you would expect (depending on the G card)?

EDIT
what i was trying to get across is that at least with most G Cards there isn't much worse performance when using 8xPCIe/8xPCIe lane mobo's as you might expect. I can't say from experience but this is what my research has led me to believe....

PS. Sleinous read my sig
 
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Sleinous

Author Level
Very good read Sleinous +rep for you my boy,
surprised the HDD section wasn't longer LOL!!!
Wouldn't you say that the choice of GFX card is down to the resolution of the screen aswell for instance where the 1GB 460 will perform better?

also the 8x/8x sli isnt a massive dent on the performance as you would expect (depending on the G card)?

Ill add this all in a sec :p what do you mean by 8x/8x? Hiopefully the mobo would have 2x pcie x16 at full bandwidth otherwise next to no point in a sli at x8/x8 bandwidth.

Ye, the HDD section WILL be getting longer :D

Good point about the res, will add that too.

EDIT: Ok we'll add all this good stuff in :D Updating now

EDIT: Haha, epic sig :p
 
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PCS

Administrator
Staff member
Brilliant advice Sleinous, I've stuck this thread for all to see! :D :D
 

Sleinous

Author Level
Hopefully this will enable me to cut down on all the typing, and we can all add stuff to this as it goes. I know ive forgotten / left loads out. (I kept remembering stuff I needed to add then i'd forget it by the time I typedup the next thing I thought of)
 

Nemesis

Moderator
Moderator
Also was thinking maybe you could have PSU requirements for those wanting to upgrade to SLI with a certain GFX card at a future date so they know how much power they need??
 

Sleinous

Author Level
Also was thinking maybe you could have PSU requirements for those wanting to upgrade to SLI with a certain GFX card at a future date so they know how much power they need??

Good idea, will do this now.

What I forgot to do when making this post is to post another two posts below my first 2 with "reserved" on them as there is a 10000 character limit on each post, eventually it will surpass that 20000 total. Any way you can add a post or two on the end of the first two PCS? :)
 

Sleinous

Author Level
amd + ati :O...they are just as important as nvidia and intel....or so i like to think so =(

I haven't started on it yet :)

I need someone to help me place each ATI GPU inbetween teh Nvidia ones in terms of performance.
 

PCS

Administrator
Staff member
What I forgot to do when making this post is to post another two posts below my first 2 with "reserved" on them as there is a 10000 character limit on each post, eventually it will surpass that 20000 total. Any way you can add a post or two on the end of the first two PCS? :)

Once you have them written we'll start a new stuck thread with them all in. Don't think you can "insert" posts, but not 100% sure.
 

Nemesis

Moderator
Moderator
errm I can edit my reply to extend your post further if you send me the text???


EDIT : hmmmm lightning edits sleinous it wont be long before you need the 3rd post imo
 
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Sleinous

Author Level
Once you have them written we'll start a new stuck thread with them all in. Don't think you can "insert" posts, but not 100% sure.

Oki dokes, in the meantime ill send the extra stuff to Nemesis when we've filled up the 2nd post with goodness :p
 

Sleinous

Author Level
New: Added a bit about PSU reqs for SLI configs on all nvid cards (dual cards only, no tri sli)

Next will add a similar thing for crossfire ATI

Edit: Added Crossfire PSU Reqs.
 
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Nemesis

Moderator
Moderator
Offer still stands
Where ya been sleinous or where have you gone, im sure you sed but i dont have a very good memory (oops)

And as far as the gpu performance list itd be hard to compare ati and nvidia due to other factors such as nvidias computing ability or ati's lower power requirements and (better value for gaming? i believe)

so maybe keep as seperate lists for meantime unless u decide on a game benchmark or something to compare them all on even grounds

sorry about the horrible readability of my post :p oh well
 
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