Will you Upgrade to win 10

ubuysa

The BSOD Doctor
So from what I understand as long as you upgrade within the first year you can keep it forever?

If it was subscription based then I wouldn't mind, depending on the price. If you think about it windows costs around £70 at the moment and most people will keep their PC for 5 years or less, so anything around £15 or less a year is completely reasonable and I'd actually prefer it, since it costs less upfront when you buy a new pc

My understanding is that this is very similar to the Windows 8 early-adopter low price deal, the difference in this case is that the early-adopter price is free. Once you have Windows 10 installed it will work forever.

The key thing to realise here is that in the past Microsoft could afford to support several versions of Windows at the same time, but with Windows 10 having to run on multiple devices Microsoft cannot now afford to support several versions (and especially versions that are only desktop based (like 7)) so they clearly want everyone on Windows 10. To achieve that they have made it free to everyone with a currently supported version of Windows (i.e. 7 or above) but only for a year to encourage us to upgrade.
 

dogbot

Bright Spark
'Forever' only means as long as the computer it is installed on lasts. The situation would be no different from now with an OEM OS so each time a computer was purchased, it would have a new copy of Windows. In the past, a new version of Windows would be released roughly every 5 years or about the life of a computer. Should the 2 not coincide, there was always the option of buying a retail version that could be used on any computer (one at a time). I obtained a cheap pre-release W7 this way. However this option no longer exists since, with W8 onwards, only an upgrade version is available.

Those who had XP will remember that after about a year it became bogged down and a reinstall was generally required. W7 was much improved in this respect but old habits die hard. I can't say any reinstall was absolutely required but it was a useful way of clearing the rubbish. Microsoft thinks it has made the upgrade path reliable enough that a reinstall is seldom (if ever) required. So far, all the W10 beta versions have been delivered that way although there are ISO's for those that require them (me). The benefits are that the OS can be continually improved instead of having a 5 year cycle, and everyone will be using the same OS. Set up your OS and programs correctly and there should be no need to change. New computer? Just save your settings and data. At least, that's the theory.

The trouble is I like W7 but do not like (or use) W8/8.1. I still need to be convinced about W10
 
Last edited:

mrcrippy

New member
Hello

There are some of us, who simply cannot afford to 'upgrade' to newer OS versions every time Micro$oft dictates. I've only got Win 8 as a recent gift from a friend.
 

ubuysa

The BSOD Doctor
'Forever' only means as long as the computer it is installed on lasts. The situation would be no different from now with an OEM OS so each time a computer was purchased, it would have a new copy of Windows. In the past, a new version of Windows would be released roughly every 5 years or about the life of a computer. Should the 2 not coincide, there was always the option of buying a retail version that could be used on any computer (one at a time). I obtained a cheap pre-release W7 this way. However this option no longer exists since, with W8 onwards, only an upgrade version is available.

Those who had XP will remember that after about a year it became bogged down and a reinstall was generally required. W7 was much improved in this respect but old habits die hard. I can't say any reinstall was absolutely required but it was a useful way of clearing the rubbish. Microsoft thinks it has made the upgrade path reliable enough that a reinstall is seldom (if ever) required. So far, all the W10 beta versions have been delivered that way although there are ISO's for those that require them (me). The benefits are that the OS can be continually improved instead of having a 5 year cycle, and everyone will be using the same OS. Set up your OS and programs correctly and there should be no need to change. New computer? Just save your settings and data. At least, that's the theory.

The trouble is I like W7 but do not like (or use) W8/8.1. I still need to be convinced about W10

I'm not sure that OEM has much to do with the Windows 10 offer. The Windows 8 early-adopter offer allowed you to download an ISO that was effectively a retail version (i.e. not tied to a single machine). I know this because I had it installed on two laptops (though not at the same time of course). In any case there is no way for Microsoft to ship an OEM licensed version to end users. The way Microsoft validated your right to the early-adopter offer was by requiring you to buy and download it from a valid version of Windows 7. I expect Windows 10 to be available the same way, i.e. you will have to download an ISO and you will only be able to do that from qualifying versions of 7/8/8.1, but what you'll get will be a Windows 10 version that will install on any number of machines, just only one at a time. So your Windows 10 license will last forever, you'll be able to install it on a new machine if you want, as long as it's removed from the old one - just as you can with the Windows 8 early-adopter system.

Personally I still recommend reinstalling Windows (7/8/8.1) periodically, I do mine about once a year. The problems with Windows are twofold;

Firstly (and less importantly) file fragmentation of the disk becomes a big issue over time - this is the biggest and commonest cause of system slowdowns on older machines. The Windows defragger can only defrag files, it cannot reorganise them, and that's the real problem. An optimising defragger can solve this issue by letting you place files and folders in the best locations on disk. Failing that a reinstall of Windows does a sort of automatic optimising defrag because everything gets written to concurrent tracks. Of course, SSDs remove this problem completely (well, almost completely).

The real problem though is that Windows is appallingly bad at tracking program installs and uninstalls, that's why most people use an intelligent uninstaller (though even they aren't perfect). Over time dll/exe/bin files get left behind, garbage builds up in the registry, disk space becomes filled with data files from uninstalled software etc. Generally none of this causes problems, but as we all know it can, and when it does the resulting problem is often very difficult to track down. On rare occasions this is true of Windows updates as well, I'm sure we've all had occasion to back out (i.e. system restore) after one or more updates have failed to install/uninstall properly. Coming from a large mainframe environment where managing program updates is critical, the almost casual way in which Windows handles program updates is quite obvious. So, for me at least, until Windows manages program installs/uninstalls much more effectively it will always benefit from a periodic reinstall - just to clean out all that rubbish.
 
Last edited:

SpyderTracks

We love you Ukraine
I'm not sure that OEM has much to do with the Windows 10 offer. The Windows 8 early-adopter offer allowed you to download an ISO that was effectively a retail version (i.e. not tied to a single machine). I know this because I had it installed on two laptops (though not at the same time of course). In any case there is no way for Microsoft to ship an OEM licensed version to end users. The way Microsoft validated your right to the early-adopter offer was by requiring you to buy and download it from a valid version of Windows 7. I expect Windows 10 to be available the same way, i.e. you will have to download an ISO and you will only be able to do that from qualifying versions of 7/8/8.1, but what you'll get will be a Windows 10 version that will install on any number of machines, just only one at a time. So your Windows 10 license will last forever, you'll be able to install it on a new machine if you want, as long as it's removed from the old one - just as you can with the Windows 8 early-adopter system.

Personally I still recommend reinstalling Windows (7/8/8.1) periodically, I do mine about once a year. The problems with Windows are twofold;

Firstly (and less importantly) file fragmentation of the disk becomes a big issue over time - this is the biggest and commonest cause of system slowdowns on older machines. The Windows defragger can only defrag files, it cannot reorganise them, and that's the real problem. An optimising defragger can solve this issue by letting you place files and folders in the best locations on disk. Failing that a reinstall of Windows does a sort of automatic optimising defrag because everything gets written to concurrent tracks. Of course, SSDs remove this problem completely (well, almost completely).

The real problem though is that Windows is appallingly bad at tracking program installs and uninstalls, that's why most people use an intelligent uninstaller (though even they aren't perfect). Over time dll/exe/bin files get left behind, garbage builds up in the registry, disk space becomes filled with data files from uninstalled software etc. Generally none of this causes problems, but as we all know it can, and when it does the resulting problem is often very difficult to track down. On rare occasions this is true of Windows updates as well, I'm sure we've all had occasion to back out (i.e. system restore) after one or more updates have failed to install/uninstall properly. Coming from a large mainframe environment where managing program updates is critical, the almost casual way in which Windows handles program updates is quite obvious. So, for me at least, until Windows manages program installs/uninstalls much more effectively it will always benefit from a periodic reinstall - just to clean out all that rubbish.

I totally agree, although slow downs do seem to have improved greatly in windows 8, I haven't reinstalled since installing win 8 as there hasn't been any apparent slow down which is a first for me. Usually I do a reinstall every 6 months or so to optimise performance.

I'm not sure if the improvement is actually due to win 8 or SSD's.
 

mdwh

Enthusiast
I can't remember the last time I bothered to reinstall, and haven't had adverse affects. But I've used SSDs on everything for the last few years.

There used to be a problem that Windows would keep old DLLs around forever (in case an update need to be backed off), which meant the size would grow and grow. With 8, these are now deleted after 30 days, so it's no longer a problem.

As for files being left around after uninstallation - well, who cares. If I'm running out of space, I'll use Sequoiaview to quickly find large files using up space, and find anything that is taking up space and no longer needed. For smaller files, it doesn't matter. Lots of files causing degfragmentation isn't an issue with SSDs.

There are some of us, who simply cannot afford to 'upgrade' to newer OS versions every time Micro$oft dictates. I've only got Win 8 as a recent gift from a friend.
MS doesn't dictate, it's no different to many other products where you have to pay for a new version. All the more reason to upgrade to 10 in the first year when it's free :)
 

Pagey

Bright Spark
I'm actually loving W10 right now! Tbh there isn't much different I can do on W10 that I can't do on W8.1 already, but I have to admit the whole thing doesn't feel like a cobbled mess, everything seems to be in the right place. Gone is the charm bar, I never used the thing tbh and I doubt many others did either. Having the start menu back properly certainly helps a lot and the fact Metro isn't forced upon you any more is a massive plus, all apps open windowed rather than forcing you into full screen, same goes for Metro, sorry Start Menu!

Though the feedback and other support apps are a brilliant touch as it returns feedback instantly to the devs. Let's put it this way: I complained as there was a lack of manually adjusting the brightness using hotkeys and in some cases you couldn't adjust brightness at all, this morning an update went out and now brightness is adjustable again! Yey!

I've also got W10 happily running on a Samsung NC10 (vanilla). XD
 
I will use it even if it was going to cost money just to get rid of the bloody charm bar.

I am so frustrated with the charm bar that I still keep thinking of registering for the Windows 10 program and downloading it just so I can use my laptop without the charm bar, but am still unsure as a novice whether I should risk trying Windows 10 before its release

glad to hear you like it Pagey
 

Wozza63

Biblical Poster
I will use it even if it was going to cost money just to get rid of the bloody charm bar.

I am so frustrated with the charm bar that I still keep thinking of registering for the Windows 10 program and downloading it just so I can use my laptop without the charm bar, but am still unsure as a novice whether I should risk trying Windows 10 before its release

glad to hear you like it Pagey

I've never had a problem with it. I rarely use it but it stays out of the way.
 

Tom DWC

Moderator
Moderator
Only had a brief play with the preview but I like what I see, it should work well for desktop users and tablets, rather than compromising the traditional experience. Much like 7 was a polished Vista 10 will hopefully be a refined version of 8. Probably won't set the world alight but if it restores some of what made 7 great, which it does, while improving on the benefits of 8 with some new features I'll be more than happy.

As I've said many a time before I believe the criticism towards Windows 8 was massively overblown, one third party program sorted out most of the issues on desktops and laptops. Though this shouldn't of been necessary, that much is true, aside from all that it was a leaner, faster OS than 7 and had some small but neat improvements (task manager etc).

Essentially making it free for any system already running 8/8.1 is a nice move. While I don't personally like subscription models (thanks to Adobe, who are bleeding our Universities dry, even more so than they were already) it can be of benefit people who use multiple installs as it can work out cheaper.
 

mrducking

Bright Spark
Just as Tom DWC said, the 10 seems a nice improvement over 7/8.1, enabling a lot of personalization/configuration options that 8 lacked and making a huge improvement over 7 in use of resources.

I think the main problem with Windows 8/8.1 was the fact that they tried to shove down our throats the metro model, even if they didnt realize it at the moment... and the turn off button to shut down the pc, man that was a serious mess.

I have high hopes for Windows 10, specially like the possibility of saving your configuration and loading it in a new PC with Windows 10, I have been using that on my phone with Windows Phone 8/8.1 and let me tell you, it's simply awesome.

I'm still going to wait a bit more to install anyway, to see how it's received by people and what may be the downsides, but will almost surely go to 10 in a few months, if only for the performance gain over my windows 7.
 

mdwh

Enthusiast
I switch off my computer by pressing the power button - same way I do my TV or phone. Easy :) (Windows 8.1 restored the option to turn off to the start menu.)

AFAICT Metro will be just as present in 10 as it was in 8/8.1, but with new abilities such as running them in windowed option. And you'll be able to run the start menu in a small window again rather than being full screen (but it still looks like a Windows 8 style menu, with things like tiles).
 

blakeyxd

Member
Will certainly be upgrading. Its free so why not; the benefits of dx12 will certainly be worth it in the long run. Plus who doesn't want multiple desktops????
 

ubuysa

The BSOD Doctor
Will certainly be upgrading. Its free so why not; the benefits of dx12 will certainly be worth it in the long run. Plus who doesn't want multiple desktops????
They're not really multiple desktops. They're the same desktop with everything else minimised. Still, it's a step in the right direction.
 
Top