thinking about getting a mini PC at some point, would appreciate advice

Adli

Enthusiast
so i've had my Optimus III laptop for over 4 years and its still working perfectly, but showing its age. after 4 years with a laptop i really don't want to have to deal with a full-size PC (finding desk space, moving house, etc) so have decided to look into mini PC's. i quite like the Node 304 case, but i much prefer the console-style (dimensions are pretty close to the Xbox 360) of the Node 202 as it should be able to fit behind my monitor and guarantee that no matter how big my desk is it will fit. i'm not in urgent need of a new computer, but ideally i would like to pull the trigger within a few months and upgrade.

the one downside of of the Node 202 is that is can only hold 2.5" drives. ideally i want a small SSD for the OS, then a large HDD to hold my music (100GB) and steam library (about 200gb), but the only 2.5" HDD's are 5400 RPM. so i can either use an SSD (preferably 480gb as my laptop is currently using about 500gb) or a 1TB HDD which is more than enough space but is going to be a lot slower than the SSD (but also £80 cheaper).

i will be using the PC to game with primarily (1080p 60 FPS, high/ultra), hence the i5-6500 and GTX 1060. the 6500 seems like a decent improvement over the 6400 for only £25. i was initially looking at the GTX 1050ti, but after looking online, the GTX 1060 6GB looks like a much better investment for the future than the 1050ti or the 3gb 1060 which might struggle with some titles.

so my question is, should i go for the 1TB HDD at 5400 RPM, or pay extra for the 480GB SSD?

specs i'm looking at currently (feel free to input advice or comments):

Case
FRACTAL DESIGN NODE 202 Mini ITX Case

Processor (CPU)
Intel® Core™i5 Quad Core Processor i5-6500 (3.2GHz) 6MB Cache

Motherboard
ASUS® Z170I PRO GAMING: Mini-ITX, LG1151, USB 3.1, SATA 6GBs

Memory (RAM)
16GB Kingston DUAL DDR4 2133MHz (2 x 8GB)

Graphics Card
6GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 1060 - DVI, HDMI, 3 x DP - GeForce GTX VR Ready!
FREE HOLIDAY SEASON BUNDLE with select GTX 10 Series GPUs!

1st Hard Disk
120GB KINGSTON UV400 2.5" SSD, SATA 6 Gb (550MB/R, 350MB/W)

2nd Hard Disk
480GB KINGSTON UV400 2.5" SSD, SATA 6 Gb (550MB/R, 500MB/W)

1st DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
NOT REQUIRED

Power Supply
INTEGRATED FRACTAL INTEGRA 450W SFX PSU (For Fractal Node 202 Case Only)

Power Cable
1 x 1 Metre UK Power Cable (Kettle Lead)

Processor Cooling
PCS FrostFlow 40 Series High Performance CPU Cooler

Thermal Paste
ARCTIC MX-4 EXTREME THERMAL CONDUCTIVITY COMPOUND

Extra Case Fans
2x 120mm Black Case Fan (configured to extract from rear/roof)

Sound Card
ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)

Wireless/Wired Networking
GIGABIT LAN PORT + Wi-Fi (Wi-Fi excluded on H110I-PLUS)

USB Options
MIN. 2 x USB 3.0 & 4 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL + MIN. 2 FRONT PORTS

Operating System
Genuine Windows 10 Home 64 Bit - inc DVD & Licence

Operating System Language
United Kingdom - English Language

Office Software
NO OFFICE SOFTWARE

Anti-Virus
BullGuard™ Internet Security - Free 90 Day License inc. Gamer Mode

Browser
Google Chrome™

Warranty
3 Year Silver Warranty (1 Year Collect & Return, 1 Year Parts, 3 Year Labour)

Price: £1,204.00 including VAT and delivery.

i'm not adding peripherals as i plan to use the second monitor (1920x1080, 60Hz), keyboard, mouse and headphones that i am currently using with my laptop. £1200 is pretty much as high as i am able to go so if i've spent too much in certain areas, i'd appreciate the advice.
 

Oussebon

Multiverse Poster
the one downside of of the Node 202 is that is can only hold 2.5" drives. ideally i want a small SSD for the OS, then a large HDD to hold my music (100GB) and steam library (about 200gb), but the only 2.5" HDD's are 5400 RPM. so i can either use an SSD (preferably 480gb as my laptop is currently using about 500gb) or a 1TB HDD which is more than enough space but is going to be a lot slower than the SSD (but also £80 cheaper).
An alternative is to get a Z170 motherboard and add an M.2 SSD. They plug into the mobo and lie flat against it:
samsung-SSD-installed.jpg
You can also get some very, very fast ones like the SM961.

i will be using the PC to game with primarily (1080p 60 FPS, high/ultra), hence the i5-6500 and GTX 1060. the 6500 seems like a decent improvement over the 6400 for only £25. i was initially looking at the GTX 1050ti, but after looking online, the GTX 1060 6GB looks like a much better investment for the future than the 1050ti or the 3gb 1060 which might struggle with some titles.
Agreed on both counts.

My biggest concern is the case. While high end gaming parts will physically fit in it, it's not really designed for powerful gaming builds, it strikes me more as an HTPC with a bit of gaming on the side. It appears to suffer from temperature issues:
http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/chassis/84668-fractal-design-node-202/?page=3
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cases/2016/02/11/fractal-design-node-202-review/4
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article1464-page5.html (980 strix hitting 90 degrees there...)
http://www.madshrimps.be/articles/a...ign-Node-202-Enclosure-Review/3#axzz4IoW1sc5D

Compare it to the temps in another case like the Obsidian 250D
http://www.anandtech.com/show/7710/corsair-obsidian-250d-case-review/5
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cases/2016/02/11/fractal-design-node-202-review/4
Bit tech use the same hardware config to test both of the cases as well so you can see a pretty stark difference.

The 1060 6gb may be okay, especially if the model PCS happen to use has a blower cooler rather than an open air one (what they'll use will depend on their current stock).

If you're determined to proceed with the Node 202 I'd add as much extra cooling as possible (there's an option to add case fans) and set aggressive fan profiles when you get the thing.
 

Adli

Enthusiast
Hmm. After watching a few reviews of the Corsair 250d it really doesn't seem as large as I thought it was. Plus it can mount an optical drive bay for adding music from CDs as well as more flexible drive bays. On the subject of cooling, would you recommend water cooling or air cooling if I decide to use the 250d? I won't be overclocking the CPU, but I'm wary of potentially having a non blower GPU heating up the inside of the case. The money saved on not needing a second SSD can go towards a H55 cooler for example, or is that overkill?
 

Oussebon

Multiverse Poster
The Obsidian 250D seems to behave itself temps wise:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/7710/corsair-obsidian-250d-case-review/5
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cases/2016/02/11/fractal-design-node-202-review/4
http://www.planet3dnow.de/cms/9333-...an-250d/subpage-temperaturen-und-lautstaerke/
https://uk.hardware.info/reviews/54...s-mini-testresults-cooling-100-a-100+100-watt

So the Noctua low profile cooler should be fine. The H55 is also loud: http://www.eteknix.com/corsair-hydro-series-h55-liquid-cpu-cooler-review/7/ I believe the fan runs at a fixed speed so it doesn't quiet down when the rest of your PC is being quiet due to not being under gaming etc load.

If you've got a touch of free budget I'd consider the i5 6600 for the upto 300MHz boost clock: https://ark.intel.com/compare/88184,88188,88191 as that may slightly improve performance and just feed future GPUs that bit better. And if there's cash left over after that faster DDR4 can be a significant asset: http://www.hardwareunboxed.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1570

Which SSD are you going for?
 

Adli

Enthusiast
I've picked the Kingston 120gb UV400 as an OS drive but if there are better options I'm all ears.

I'm thinking of either:

sticking with the i5 6500, getting a noctua fan and perhaps going for the 3000 MHz ram.

Or getting the i5 6600 with the noctua fan and 2133mhz ram.

Both options are roughly the same price, I'm not sure how much of a bonus each one would give comparatively.
 

sanj

Moderator
Moderator
Hi I've built many (if not all!) of the 250D for PCSpecialist and can say that it will easily take a H60 water cooler and the GTX 1060 that you want. It has a rather large 140mm front intake fan which does keep the case rather cool.
 

Oussebon

Multiverse Poster
I've picked the Kingston 120gb UV400 as an OS drive but if there are better options I'm all ears.
I'd probably advise a 240gb drive, as 120gb can get filled up quite quickly and also 240gb drives are somewhat faster http://lifehacker.com/opt-for-the-larger-ssd-capacity-to-also-get-a-speed-boo-1770691500

Given that you're a) not going for an overclockable system b) are quite likely to get the regular 2133MHz RAM and c) aren't going for an M.2 SSD, you may consider the ASUS® H110I-PLUS motherboard instead. It's £80 cheaper and you're not using the features the Z170 offers. Unlike the Z170 it doesn't have in built wifi but you can get a USB wifi adapter for a few £ which will do the job. It doesn't have USB 3.1 either but that's not a massive deal for a gaming PC. Arguably not worth an £80 premium.

Both options are roughly the same price, I'm not sure how much of a bonus each one would give comparatively.
I've no idea. Personally I'd go with the i5 6600 and the 2133MHz RAM if it's a choice between the two. I think the Noctua cooler's fine as well - sanj makes the point about the front fan ebing quite effective (I think it's one of the nice Corsair AF140L fans so that makes sense).
 

Adli

Enthusiast
Ok so I've gone away and done some research and thinking about the future, and not in the panic inducing dread kind of way. I'm thinking that the i5 6600 is a good idea since it turbo boosts a lot higher than the 6500. I'll use the noctua air cooler since I've read lots of people say that it's more than capable for non-overclocking. If it's a problem in the future I can think about getting a better cooler. The money I saved from that went into a 240gb SSD for a bit more storage leeway and faster OS loading.

As for the GPU, I'm thinking of sticking with a GTX 1050ti for now, since there are rumours of a pascal refresh next year as well as next gen Volta GPUs in 2018. If replacing the GPU is easy to do myself I would like to swap it out for a 2060 or whatever when they release. Seems silly to buy a 1060 now if new versions are potentially coming in less than a year. The 1050ti will last me a while anyway since I'm only playing at 1920x1080.

Here's the new build im thinking of for £1030

Case
CORSAIR OBSIDIAN 250D MINI-ITX CASE
Processor (CPU)
Intel® Core™i5 Quad Core Processor i5-6600 (3.3GHz) 6MB Cache
Motherboard
ASUS® H110I-PLUS: Mini-ITX, LG1151, USB 3.0, SATA 6GBs
Memory (RAM)
16GB HyperX FURY DDR4 2133MHz (2 x 8GB)
Graphics Card
4GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 1050 Ti - DVI, HDMI, DP
FREE HOLIDAY SEASON BUNDLE with select GTX 10 Series GPUs!
1st Hard Disk
240GB KINGSTON UV400 2.5" SSD, SATA 6 Gb (550MB/R, 490MB/W)
2nd Hard Disk
1TB WD BLACK 3.5" WD1003FZEX, SATA 6 Gb/s, 64MB CACHE (7200rpm)
1st DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
24x DUAL LAYER DVD WRITER ±R/±RW/RAM
Power Supply
CORSAIR 350W VS SERIES™ VS-350 POWER SUPPLY
Power Cable
1 x 1 Metre UK Power Cable (Kettle Lead)
Processor Cooling
Noctua NH-L9i Low Profile, Super Quiet CPU Cooler
Thermal Paste
ARCTIC MX-4 EXTREME THERMAL CONDUCTIVITY COMPOUND
Extra Case Fans
2x 120mm Apache Black Quiet Fan (fitted to extract from rear/roof)
Sound Card
ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Wireless/Wired Networking
GIGABIT LAN PORT + Wi-Fi (Wi-Fi excluded on H110I-PLUS)
USB Options
MIN. 2 x USB 3.0 & 4 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL + MIN. 2 FRONT PORTS
Operating System
Genuine Windows 10 Home 64 Bit - inc DVD & Licence
Operating System Language
United Kingdom - English Language
Office Software
FREE 30 Day Trial of Microsoft® Office® 365
Anti-Virus
BullGuard™ Internet Security - Free 90 Day License inc. Gamer Mode
Browser
Google Chrome™
Surge Protection
MasterPlug SRG62 6 Socket 2m Surge Protector
Cable Management
PCS 1.5M Zip Cable Tidy - Professional Cable Management
Warranty
3 Year Silver Warranty (1 Year Collect & Return, 1 Year Parts, 3 Year Labour)
Delivery
STANDARD INSURED DELIVERY TO UK MAINLAND (MON-FRI)
Build Time
Standard Build - Approximately 3 to 5 working days
Quantity
1

Price: £1,030.00 including VAT and delivery.

Unique URL to re-configure: http://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/quotes/intel-skylake-sff-gaming/wQX5A5ngWp/
 

keynes

Multiverse Poster
Choice of gpu depends on the type of games you play. If you are confident the gtx 1050 ti will meet your requirements then it is a good choice but replacing the gpu in less than a year doesnt seem like a good idea, better stick to the best gpu that you can afford. The 350w psu is also going to limit you in terms of future upgrades.
 

Adli

Enthusiast
Hmm ok. I'll put an extra £120 in for the 6GB 1060 and 450w power supply and keep the 120GB SSD. That'll last me quite a while and give headroom for future games. As for what I'm currently playing, it's limited by what my 4.5 year old laptop can run haha. It can play older games like world of tanks and guild wars 2 just fine, but it's really struggling on modern titles like the division which I play at minimum settings at 1366x768
 
Last edited:

Oussebon

Multiverse Poster
Probably a good call.

Just an NB on this:
and keep the 120GB SSD.
120gb is quite meagre especially if you want to put a game or two on it. Also 120gb drives are often slower than their 240gb brothers due to the way they're built: http://lifehacker.com/opt-for-the-larger-ssd-capacity-to-also-get-a-speed-boo-1770691500

The WD Blacks are faster than regular HDDs but are also a lot noisier and the relative difference between a regular HDD and a WD Black is fractional compared to the difference between either and an SSD. The WD blacks are £27 more expensive. So a 240gb + 1TB HDD is actually a touch cheaper than a 120gb SSD + 1TB WD Black, while giving you a faster SSD that is also twice as large.

For me if it were a choice between the two, a 240gb SSD + regular HDD would be the way go without hesitation.
 

Adli

Enthusiast
Hmm I did not know that, that's awesome. I've gone with the regular HDD and 240 SSD to save a few pounds. makes sense not to have a noisy hdd when I'm using quiet fans and a quiet cooler.

Should be ordering the build in February some time when I have the excuse of it being my birthday, also giving some time to sort out space for it in the mess that is my desk at the moment.
 

Adli

Enthusiast
Ok so one last question, for vanity's sake. I noticed that the customiser does not support LED lights, but would I be able to fit something like a NZXT HUE+ into the spare drive bay at a later date? Are there enough free connectors to plug an NZXT into?

It's not a big deal if there isn't but it seems like a nice touch to add later on, since I plan on getting an RGB mouse and maybe a keyboard to replace my ancient ones.
 

Oussebon

Multiverse Poster
I've no idea I'm afraid. Not sure that the board would have the spare internal USB connectors you'd need for the software control?

Also it seems quite suited to pretty elaborate LED setups, having 4 LED strip connectors. Not sure you'd get the max benefit out of that with such a small window in the case.
 

Adli

Enthusiast
No worries, hardly a deal breaker. Now I just have to wait until February then I can pull the trigger!
 

Oussebon

Multiverse Poster
Cool. Note that in early Jan some new CPUs and motherboards will be released, basically slight improvements on the current Skylake set. Skylake system may still be being sold in Feb but check out the Kaby Lake offerings as well before pulling the trigger :)
 

Adli

Enthusiast
i wouldn't be opposed to getting a Kaby Lake system either. i don't mind waiting around, i might even end up with a larger budget at some point :p
 

Adli

Enthusiast
Ok so the Kaby Lake processors just launched. The 7500 is £7 more than the 7400 and has .4 Ghz more. It's also basically the same as the 6600 I was going to get! I have noticed that the i3's now have hyperthreading, but I think an actual quad core would work better in the long term since I play a few CPU heavy games like Guild Wars 2. I'm not sure it's worth getting the 7600 over the 7500 though.

I'm also wondering if it's worth having 16GBs of RAM or not. its fairly expensive to get 16 GBs over 8GBs so I think I'll get 8GBS and then upgrade to 16 if I need it in the future.
 
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