Recoil II 15.6 - BSOD reboots to BIOS settings screen

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vk1

New member
Hi,

Just had this laptop a week and it looks like there may be a fault with it so looking for some advice on what to check. At the moment it isn't being worked too hard as I'm still installing software etc but it has BSOD'd 4 times, with 3 of them leaving it sitting at the BIOS settings screen. Windows event viewer not showing much other than 2 critical errors in the System events Kernel-Power in the last 24 hours alone. There are also messages about it not being able to write a memory dump (source volmgr with the VERY useful message : Dump file creation failed due to error during dump creation.)

The most recent incident was overnight/this morning. I ran Windows Update last night it reported everything being OK so I restarted the machine , logged in and left it sitting idle overnight. Plugged in and with the power manager set to never sleep when plugged in. And this morning it was sitting in the BIOS setup screen.

It's pretty much as it came out the box with Windows updates and an updated gfx driver. Gfx driver only updated because it was the first thing I thought off the first time this happened.

So firmware update required? More info from event viewer? Or sounds faulty get an RMA?

Thanks
 
ubuysa

ubuysa

The BSOD Doctor
What is the BSOD reason? It will help spotting this if you disable the 'automatic restart in the event of a failure' feature. In the run command box enter the command sysdm.cpl to open the system properties dialog. In there click the Advanced tab and then the Settings button in the Start-up and Recovery section, uncheck the 'Automatically restart' checkbox.

Did you buy Windows with it or install your own?

Regarding no dump file being written have a look at this: https://support.microsoft.com/en-au/help/130536/windows-does-not-save-memory-dump-file-after-a-crash
 
V

vk1

New member
Thanks for the memory dump link. Just to clarify it's one of the pre-built next day laptops (https://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/computers-for-next-day-delivery/896/) which was supplied with Win10. So as far as OS install goes it's all as PCS would have configured it I've not touched swap space, drive partitioning or upgraded any hardware. Almost box fresh. It has spent most of its time waiting for and applying Windows Updates.

I do notice that the hibernation and paging files are both less than half the size of the RAM, could there be a hibernation/power option I have missed? I usually switch the hibernation off just not gotten round to it yet.

It's had Office, Ffox, Visual Studio and a couple of other applications I use and have had installed on the Win10 system that this new machine should be replacing.

Usually I've come back to the reboot but the first time it rebooted I was checking my QGIS install by loading a test shapefile. Nothing too taxing, as I said for the most recent the machine was left idle over night. So I've switched the Auto Restart off as you suggest and I'll leave it overnight/idle over the next day or two and see what happens.

Just one additional question: I've not done so much setup that a clean/factory reset would be a problem from the point of view of re-installing, but any idea how painful finding the relevant drivers may be? I paid the extra quid for the WIndows 10 install on DVD and assume there will be some re-install partition somewhere.

Hoping to get to the bottom of this soon because it's a really nice machine.
 
ubuysa

ubuysa

The BSOD Doctor
A clean reinstall would be the wise option, it's really the only way to eliminate software as the potential cause. It's been my experience that with Windows 10 the Windows Update process finds all the necessary drivers. My recommendation then would to do a clean install (chose a custom install, delete all existing partitions and install Windows into the unallocated space - the right partition structure will be created for you) and then run Windows Update repeatedly until no more updates are found. A check with Device Manager afterwards will confirm that all drivers are installed.

If you want to have a copy of the right drivers just in case, you can download them from the main PCS website (where you placed your order). If you login there under the Tech Support section is a Downloads link, the drivers for your build will be there.

If the clean reinstall dopesn't solve the BSOD issues then phone PCS immediately.
 
T

Tony1044

Prolific Poster
ubuysa said:
A clean reinstall would be the wise option, it's really the only way to eliminate software as the potential cause. It's been my experience that with Windows 10 the Windows Update process finds all the necessary drivers. My recommendation then would to do a clean install (chose a custom install, delete all existing partitions and install Windows into the unallocated space - the right partition structure will be created for you) and then run Windows Update repeatedly until no more updates are found. A check with Device Manager afterwards will confirm that all drivers are installed.

If you want to have a copy of the right drivers just in case, you can download them from the main PCS website (where you placed your order). If you login there under the Tech Support section is a Downloads link, the drivers for your build will be there.

If the clean reinstall dopesn't solve the BSOD issues then phone PCS immediately.
Click to expand...

This is sound advice - I'd just add that you want to download Windows from Microsoft - https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/software-download/windows10 - this will ensure that you get the latest version. Otherwise, you will tend to find you install it and update all of the drivers etc only to get to a point where it then says there's a new version of Windows 10 available for download and you're faced with the choice of running an older version or doing an in-place upgrade to a newer version - and possibly with a rinse and repeat until you're bang up to date.
 
V

vk1

New member
Well I've given it 2 nights of just sitting doing nothing and it has so far not rebooted into the BIOS. I'll try over the next couple of nights and see what happens. Hopefully an update has come in which has fixed it. I'll probably go for a clean build over the weekend anyway.

Thanks for all the comments and advice so far.

UPDATE : After following the advice above and switching off the automatic reboot this morning I had a PC that had shut itself down. So problem still there. And even after switching to minidump (surely 256kB isnt too big) still no dump file being written. As this will be a dev machine that needs to be able to run overnight jobs on a schedule this is not good.

Also I've noticed it seems to disconnect and reconnect USB devices without them being unplugged. My external keyboard backlight every now and again will flash to full brightness, mouse become unresponsive and notification asking what I want to do with removeable media appears. Note I unplugged all of these devices before leaving the machine idle overnight.
 
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ubuysa

ubuysa

The BSOD Doctor
vk1 said:
Well I've given it 2 nights of just sitting doing nothing and it has so far not rebooted into the BIOS. I'll try over the next couple of nights and see what happens. Hopefully an update has come in which has fixed it. I'll probably go for a clean build over the weekend anyway.

Thanks for all the comments and advice so far.

UPDATE : After following the advice above and switching off the automatic reboot this morning I had a PC that had shut itself down. So problem still there. And even after switching to minidump (surely 256kB isnt too big) still no dump file being written. As this will be a dev machine that needs to be able to run overnight jobs on a schedule this is not good.

Also I've noticed it seems to disconnect and reconnect USB devices without them being unplugged. My external keyboard backlight every now and again will flash to full brightness, mouse become unresponsive and notification asking what I want to do with removeable media appears. Note I unplugged all of these devices before leaving the machine idle overnight.
Click to expand...

If there is no dump being written then that tends to suggest some sort of hardware failure. The disconnecting/reconnecting of USB devices hints at hardware too. A completely clean install (deleting existing partitions) is the only way to be sure however, so if you are able to do that over the weekend that is the wisest and best next step.

If you can, just install Windows and run Windows Update until no more updates are found. Check in device manager that all drivers have been installed by Windows update, then disconnect from the Internet (so that no new software/updates/drivers can be automatically installed) and leave it alone for as long as you can. That will give you the most stable software platform possible, so if it shuts down or auto-restarts in that state it's most likely a hardware issue.

Since it's new I would also open it up and check that the RAM, drives, and all connectors you can see are fully home and properly located. It's not impossible for stuff to come loose in transit.
 
V

vk1

New member
Finally freed up some time to do a clean Windows Install. As a first step I exported the current Windows Event Logs to my external hard-drive (which causes no problems with either my MacBook, Linux laptop or the Win10 machine the Recoil is supposed to be replacing) as it was writing the logs the external keyboard back light flashed and the mouse became unresponsive for 1-2 seconds. So I had a check through the logs on the ext HD just to see if 1) they saved OK and 2) could I get the apparent disconnect/reconnect to happen. They saved OK and reading through them I see that there are similar event messages about unexpected shutdowns away back on 8th November last year, a full 2 months before I took receipt of the machine on 12th Jan. So I'm wondering if a clean install will fix anything and think that a faulty machine has, unfortunately, slipped through QA. There are messages about active battery count changing and then the machine seems to power down a few seconds later, e.g.

12:45:24 Kernel-Power - active battery count change

14:51:13 volmgr - "Dump file creation failed due to error during dump creation"
14:51:13 Kernel-Power (Critical) - "The system has rebooted without cleanly shutting down first..."
14:51:18 EventLog (Error) - The previous system shutdown at 12:45:27on 19/01/2019 was unexpected.

It also (to my mind) seems to be sync'ing the system clock an awful lot. But this is the first time I've really dug into Window Event logs in possibly a decade.

Just to recap, yes it is still shutting down unexpectedly while sitting idle, no dump/minidump file gets written and I've tried to see if leaving various combinations of USB devices plugged in makes a difference. It doesn't the most recent occurrence only had the PSU plugged in and all I had done was switch the machine on. So I'll send a copy of the event logs to tech support as I'm loathe to take the back off a machine and rummage about in the innards when I've only had it a couple of weeks.

Thanks all for the replies so far and I'll update when I get an answer.
 
ubuysa

ubuysa

The BSOD Doctor
vk1 said:
Finally freed up some time to do a clean Windows Install. As a first step I exported the current Windows Event Logs to my external hard-drive (which causes no problems with either my MacBook, Linux laptop or the Win10 machine the Recoil is supposed to be replacing) as it was writing the logs the external keyboard back light flashed and the mouse became unresponsive for 1-2 seconds. So I had a check through the logs on the ext HD just to see if 1) they saved OK and 2) could I get the apparent disconnect/reconnect to happen. They saved OK and reading through them I see that there are similar event messages about unexpected shutdowns away back on 8th November last year, a full 2 months before I took receipt of the machine on 12th Jan. So I'm wondering if a clean install will fix anything and think that a faulty machine has, unfortunately, slipped through QA. There are messages about active battery count changing and then the machine seems to power down a few seconds later, e.g.

12:45:24 Kernel-Power - active battery count change

14:51:13 volmgr - "Dump file creation failed due to error during dump creation"
14:51:13 Kernel-Power (Critical) - "The system has rebooted without cleanly shutting down first..."
14:51:18 EventLog (Error) - The previous system shutdown at 12:45:27on 19/01/2019 was unexpected.

It also (to my mind) seems to be sync'ing the system clock an awful lot. But this is the first time I've really dug into Window Event logs in possibly a decade.

Just to recap, yes it is still shutting down unexpectedly while sitting idle, no dump/minidump file gets written and I've tried to see if leaving various combinations of USB devices plugged in makes a difference. It doesn't the most recent occurrence only had the PSU plugged in and all I had done was switch the machine on. So I'll send a copy of the event logs to tech support as I'm loathe to take the back off a machine and rummage about in the innards when I've only had it a couple of weeks.

Thanks all for the replies so far and I'll update when I get an answer.
Click to expand...

All those 'Windows has shut down unexpectedly' messages are a symptom not a cause. Regarding the others, and your suspicion that you have a hardware problem, a hardware issue can only be confirmed if you do a clean install of Windows and all drivers. Only then can you be sure you have a stable and reliable software platform.
 
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