Expectation management

[BT81]

All!
So, had my Desktop for around 5 months now - and I'm not sure what my expectations should be in respect of performance, as I'm always left a little 'disappointed - (Nothing to do with the build I must add! - Great job by PCS)

Background - Long life console gamer, first time PC owner.
I bought the PC, assuming I'd be getting equal / better than PS5 / Xbox Series X performance.

I only have a 1080p 144hz monitor, and assume I'd be able to whack up the graphic settings to max and be on my merry way, not a dropped frame in sight.

However.....and I know Cyberpunk it's exactly the most optimised game out there, so i'll instead use Metro Enhanced.

This is a game I am running at 1080p, with DLSS on quality - Ray Tracing on - and despite the 3070, I get plenty of dropped frames from 60fps
I'd have assumed that an PS5 could run this at 1080p, let alone 4k without bother.

Will the consoles use a 'less ray tracing quality than what I am aim for - High? Do they run ray tracing reflections?
Am I running graphic settings beyond what the next gen consoles can achieve, or is my machine 'not powerful enough'

(also add, Assassins Creed - Using Digital Foundry PC requirements at 1080p, I still can't get a locked 60fps)

- Do I need a new CPU....3700 / 3800x ?


Regards
Philip


Specs below
Case
NZXT H511 MID-TOWER GAMING CASE (WHITE)
Processor (CPU)
AMD Ryzen 5 3600x
Motherboard
ASUS® TUF X570-PLUS GAMING (USB 3.2 Gen 2, PCIe 4.0, CrossFireX) - ARGB Ready!
Memory (RAM)
16GB Corsair VENGEANCE DDR4 3200MHz (2 x 8GB)
Graphics Card
NVIDIA GEFORCE RTX 3070 - HDMI, DP
1st M.2 SSD Drive
1TB SAMSUNG 970 EVO PLUS M.2, PCIe NVMe (up to 3500MB/R, 3200MB/W)
Power Supply
CORSAIR 850W RMx SERIES™ MODULAR 80 PLUS® GOLD, ULTRA QUIET
Power Cable
1 x 1 Metre UK Power Cable (Kettle Lead)
Processor Cooling
Corsair H115i RGB PLATINUM Hydro Series High Performance CPU Cooler
Thermal Paste
STANDARD THERMAL PASTE FOR SUFFICIENT COOLING
Sound Card
ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Network Card
10/100/1000 GIGABIT LAN PORT
Wireless Network Card
WIRELESS INTEL® Wi-Fi 6 AX200 2,400Mbps/5GHz, 300Mbps/2.4GHz PCI-E CARD + BT 5.0
USB/Thunderbolt Options
MIN. 2 x USB 3.0 & 2 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL + MIN. 2 FRONT PORTS
Operating System
Windows 10 Home 64 Bit - inc. Single Licenc

 

[Scott]

I think you're being a little unrealistic with your graphics settings.

What you have chosen is perfectly fine but how many of those options can you actually see making an impact? The key difference with PC gaming is the options tend to be un-capped. Devs allow for unrealistic graphics settings with the understanding that hardware as time goes on will be able to handle them with ease. You always want to have room to grow with your releases.

Can you see the difference between medium and high on Raytracing? Have you turned on super sampling? If you have, you're likely trying to output 4k resolution. There are sooooo many settings that kill framerate with little benefit or mistunderstanding of what they do.

Most settings in a console release are dialled WAY down to try and keep the frames up. Nowadays they output at unfixed framerates so you can see how well they are performing. I'm pretty sure I saw non-existent framerates on Cyberpunk before it was pulled...... it just didn't have the power, even with the settings lower than expected.

 

[SpyderTracks]

You will always find optimised settings guides per game when they’re released.

There are many Ray Tracing games out that wouldn’t perform well even on a 3090 maxxed out, as @Scott says, devs plan with a long gaming life for AAA titles.

It took about a decade before the original Crysis game was able to be played maxed out, same for the new Crysis remastered, control, Red dead, metro enhanced, to name a very few.

PC gaming is nothing like console, you’re EXPECTED to taylor game settings to your system. It’s only really older titles that you would ever expect to play maxxed out.

You would get a far more rewarding gaming experience from upgrading your monitor to 1440p and adjusting graphics setting appropriately.

 

[BT81]

Thank you for the replys. I think when I see - Take Assassins Creed - I'm playing that at the same settings as recommended by Digital Foundry (bascially PS5 set up) - and despite the 1080p, and that being more around 1440p - It won't stay stable at 60fps.

Metro - I see your points on the set up - Interestingly, Metro I can actually tell the difference on Ray Tracing (probably the only time I've been able to) - I've knocked back my settings to the below - Again (and part of expectation management on my behalf), assumed my build would have coped - and surely a PS5 would be able to knock out 1080p 60fps - But in fairness, taking Ray Tracing as an example. I've no idea what most of it does. Ray Traced Reflections. Is that something I need a 3090gpu for.

Thank you again for the replies. I've not ordered an 8 core cpu just yet ;-)

 

[Scott]

Something strange if that's not running well. Are your drivers all up to date? That should be smashing 60fps with no problems at all (and then some).

I would download the free installation of 3DMark and run some benchmarks. There are modern ones that will allow you to test the RayTracing and modern DLSS, but if you could also throw in a Firestrike (normal) run, that will let me gauge the actual horsepower of your build.

 

[ubuysa]

The Secret Of Happiness is given by (t)=w0 +w1∑j=1tγt −jCRj +w2∑j=1tγt −jEVj +w3∑j=1tγt −jRPEj

In other words "lower your expectations"

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/...ret-happiness-and-compassion-low-expectations

 

[BT81]

Something strange if that's not running well. Are your drivers all up to date? That should be smashing 60fps with no problems at all (and then some).

I would download the free installation of 3DMark and run some benchmarks. There are modern ones that will allow you to test the RayTracing and modern DLSS, but if you could also throw in a Firestrike (normal) run, that will let me gauge the actual horsepower of your build.

I scored 25 143 in Fire Strike

AMD Ryzen 5 3600X, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 x 1, 16384 MB, 64-bit Windows 10}

www.3dmark.com

This is my firestrike results


Just been playing Metro at 1440p - and still plenty of dropped frames from 60fps, despite knocking the settings down.....

 

[Bhuna50]

Metro at 1440p? Have you changed your monitor now? You said earlier you had a 1080 monitor.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[BT81]

Metro at 1440p? Have you changed your monitor now? You said earlier you had a 1080 monitor.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I plugged it into ‘the big telly’ - heavy moving it from one room to another. Won’t make that mistake again !

 

[SpyderTracks]

I plugged it into ‘the big telly’ - heavy moving it from one room to another. Won’t make that mistake again !

I don’t think a 1440p telly exists does it?

oh, sorry, you’re downscaling the game to 1440p on a 4k telly?

 

[BT81]

I don’t think a 1440p telly exists does it?

oh, sorry, you’re downscaling the game to 1440p on a 4k telly?

Yeah sorry. 4K and set the resolution to 1440p
Since moved the box back to the study with the 1080p!

 

[Scott]

I scored 25 143 in Fire Strike

AMD Ryzen 5 3600X, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 x 1, 16384 MB, 64-bit Windows 10}

www.3dmark.com

This is my firestrike results


Just been playing Metro at 1440p - and still plenty of dropped frames from 60fps, despite knocking the settings down.....

Nothing wrong there, it's hitting right where it should, boosting fine with good temperatures. CPU is boosting well at peak and your RAM is all set to the correct frequency.

From that, your system hardware has the performance. I can only think that it's something down to the install or the drivers.

I read recently about issues with RGB software and NVidia. It may be directly related to VR only, but it may be worthwhile starting from a fresh install to see what it runs like in such a state.

If you're happy to try this, here is what you should do:

Backup everything from your main drive that you need to keep and cannot simply re-download.
Download the Windows Media Creation tool & install the Windows Installer onto a 8GB+ USB pen drive
Do a FULL clean install of Windows onto your primary drive
Once installed download the X570 chipset drivers direct from AMD & install them
Download the latest version of the GPU drivers from Nvidia & install them
Run Windows update multiple times until there are no updates, multiple restarts will likely be required. Just let it do its thing and keep trying until nothing comes up.
Install steam and whichever game you want to try out (or the game loader required for the game).
Install the FPS monitoring software you want to use to check for dropped frames.... note, it has been said in the past that this software itself can cause dropped frames but you don't have much option. I would recommend Afterburner for this with Rivatuner...it just tends to be my go-to choice.

Don't install anything else or run anything else. Load up the FPS counter and the game and see how she runs.

If all is good and it's performing better, start taking your system back to how you had it..... periodically checking for dropped frames to try and identify the culprit.


If you don't fancy doing this you will have to do a deep dive into your processes to see if you can identify what is hogging the resources.

 

[BT81]

Scott, sorry for the late reply! I've re-installed windows more time than I care to remember since the machine arrived in December. I'll for the moment take a view it's my expectations and being a newbie PC owner that it the issue. And it would appear that rings true having read....this

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/...odus-enhanced-edition-on-xbox-series-consoles

Reading through the article, it would appear the new almighty xbox is running without some of the fancy graphic settings, I'd have assumed the new generation would lap up.

So it'll be interesting to see how it runs with 'similar graphical settings' - I have to run with v-sync on, as I get terriable screen tearing without (I don't have a g sync monitor, only a freesync). But I will assume I can run a stable 60fps at 1080 with RT on, RT reflections off as per console settings, and then tweak upwards afterwards.

 

[SpyderTracks]

Scott, sorry for the late reply! I've re-installed windows more time than I care to remember since the machine arrived in December. I'll for the moment take a view it's my expectations and being a newbie PC owner that it the issue. And it would appear that rings true having read....this

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/...odus-enhanced-edition-on-xbox-series-consoles

Reading through the article, it would appear the new almighty xbox is running without some of the fancy graphic settings, I'd have assumed the new generation would lap up.

So it'll be interesting to see how it runs with 'similar graphical settings' - I have to run with v-sync on, as I get terriable screen tearing without (I don't have a g sync monitor, only a freesync). But I will assume I can run a stable 60fps at 1080 with RT on, RT reflections off as per console settings, and then tweak upwards afterwards.

Freesync works fine with nvidia graphics, you just have to enable it:

How to enable G-Sync on a FreeSync monitor

G-Sync compatible monitors explained

www.techradar.com

 

[BT81]

Off to buy a display port cable ;-)

 

[BT81]

Cable arrived, g sync enabled, frame rate unlocked. And…. Huge frame drops. Well that didn’t workout as planned 😭😭😭

 

[BT81]

So, half v sync has been a saviour! Metro Enhanced edition has finally become an enjoyable experience.
With the monitor set to 144hz, and a half v sync producing a very stable 72fps.

I tried uncapped frame rate, but all that did was create a super noisy GPU and the frame rate wasn't overly that stable.

Playing Days Gone. Again, perfect. stable 72fps. Whereas if I try and cap it to 60, like I did Metro produced 'worse' frame rate drops.

Just a shame this hasn't resolved the issue on AC Valhalla