No display after updating motherboard BIOS

[Warbloke]

Hi, I called Tech support and have something to try tonight... but thought Id check with the forum if anyone has experienced this and could hopefully help too.

So I was having an issue with Windows 10 wanting to always update itself. It constantly failed to put in the Fall update (which I learned was due to me having an NVMe hard drive)
(400GB INTEL® 750 SERIES PCIe SSD )
That issue is well documented out there I learned... but the solution was not.
I read things to suggest perhaps updating the BIOS on my motherboard might help... so I did... and here is where my big issue happened.

I used the motherboards (Gigabyte X99 Gaming 5P) built in Q-FLASH capability to update to the latest BIOS version (F24b ) that was available on the Gigabyte Website.
Its a very straight forward process to do. Its hard to go wrong... download the BIOS file... put in on a flash drive... browse to it and update.
Everything looked like it was going well on screen... progress bar moving along etc...
Once it got to the end it rebooted... then... nothing.
I have no display. The monitor (connected via Display port to my Nvidia GTX980Ti) remains blank like there is no signal.
There is no BEEP either.
I tried connecting via DVI to VGA... but no display either.
This motherboard has no Onboard graphics so I cant connect that way.

I then tried the other BIOS version... using the Q-FLASH-PLUS method.... including the one I see PCspecialist must have originally saved in my downloads.

(Removing my RAM (KINGSTON HYPER-X PREDATOR QUAD-DDR4 3000MHz X.M.P), downloading the BIOS file.... putting it on a USB key renaming the file to GIGABYTE.bin..... putting it in the white USB port... RAM back in and switching on....
The LED flashes orange as I read it should.... comes back on solid.... gave it some time.... )
issue remains though... so Im stuck with a dead PC.

I called tech support... Im advised to try flashing it back to the latest version again... then try disconnecting my NVMe hard drive and powering on.
I will try this tonight and see what happens.
If that doesn't work Id need to send it in they say.


I have also ordered a cheaper graphics card (Gigabyte GV-N210SL-1GI GeForce 210 Graphics Card (1GB, ATX, DVI-I, VGA HDMI) )
as its only £25 to plug that in, then try a VGA output to a VGA monitor encase its switched to some crazy low resolution that my GPU and or Monitor cant see.


Can anyone think of anything else I can try ?

 

[BlessedSquirrel]

That board has a dual bios, so it should have the original bios version still applied on the back up chip. Check the manual on how to boot the secondary bios chip. Usually there’s a switch on the board or something.

 

[Warbloke]

That board has a dual bios, so it should have the original bios version still applied on the back up chip. Check the manual on how to boot the secondary bios chip. Usually there’s a switch on the board or something.

Hmm, in the manual:
http://download.gigabyte.eu/FileList/Manual/mb_manual_ga-x99-gaming-5p_e.pdf

It talks about having the dual BIOS feature and what it does, but it doesn't explain how to force it to use the backup that I can find.
I did find online someone saying you can hold the power and reset button for 10 seconds (which I tried)
Also they say you can short pins 1 and 6 (which I haven't tried)
Im actually unsure if flashing using the Q-FLASH-PLUS method, this overwrites it anyways.

 

[BlessedSquirrel]

Hmm, in the manual:
http://download.gigabyte.eu/FileList/Manual/mb_manual_ga-x99-gaming-5p_e.pdf

It talks about having the dual BIOS feature and what it does, but it doesn't explain how to force it to use the backup that I can find.
I did find online someone saying you can hold the power and reset button for 10 seconds (which I tried)
Also they say you can short pins 1 and 6 (which I haven't tried)
Im actually unsure if flashing using the Q-FLASH-PLUS method, this overwrites it anyways.

If you can wait a bit, I’ll have a look when I’m at home.

 

[Lez501]

Hmm, in the manual:
http://download.gigabyte.eu/FileList/Manual/mb_manual_ga-x99-gaming-5p_e.pdf

It talks about having the dual BIOS feature and what it does, but it doesn't explain how to force it to use the backup that I can find.
I did find online someone saying you can hold the power and reset button for 10 seconds (which I tried)
Also they say you can short pins 1 and 6 (which I haven't tried)
Im actually unsure if flashing using the Q-FLASH-PLUS method, this overwrites it anyways.

It should be an automatic operation preformed by the motherboard itself if the main bios becomes corrupt, you cannot force it, nor alter the back-up bios.

 

[Warbloke]

It should be an automatic operation preformed by the motherboard itself if the main bios becomes corrupt, you cannot force it, nor alter the back-up bios.

yeh, Im not sure its corrupt. I bought this PC here in 2015, its been solid as a rock.
I don't think anything will be suddenly broken or damaged. I just think its a config thing resulting in no display.
I will try removing/ disconnecting the NVMe hard drive and switch on to see what happens, and tomorrow night I can try a different graphics card once its delivered

 

[Warbloke]

boo, nothings working :/
Tried removing hard drive... still no BEEP and no display.
Removed all RAM, tried different cheap GPU using VGA and different VGA monitor.... no BEEP no display.
Reset CMOS (as per Gigabyte supports advice - removing the battery for a while) no BEEP no display.

Im seriously annoyed their updated and supposedly better BIOS has rendered the motherboard useless.

I guess I will need to contact Tech Support again and see what they suggest.
No doubt I will need to send it in though. no idea if I still have its big box :/

 

[BlessedSquirrel]

boo, nothings working :/
Tried removing hard drive... still no BEEP and no display.
Removed all RAM, tried different cheap GPU using VGA and different VGA monitor.... no BEEP no display.
Reset CMOS (as per Gigabyte supports advice - removing the battery for a while) no BEEP no display.

Im seriously annoyed their updated and supposedly better BIOS has rendered the motherboard useless.

I guess I will need to contact Tech Support again and see what they suggest.
No doubt I will need to send it in though. no idea if I still have its big box :/

The BIOS is fried. The MOBO will need to be replaced, under warranty of course.

 

[Warbloke]

well, I phoned Tech support.... now Im REALLY worried :/

As expected I will need to send it in, apparently they can send me packaging at a cost too if I need it so that's all fine.

I queried though... I bought this PC in August 2015 (with a Gold Warranty)
So This says parts for 2 years and Labour for 3 years.

Now while labour should be covered... I mentioned I read that Gigabyte cover their Motherboards for 3 years... is that correct ?
Im told they would need to check... it depends.... regardless when I bought the PC... it would depend on when THEY bought the motherboard.
I confirmed... so if it had been sitting on your shelves for 6 months...before you sold me the PC... you are saying it wouldn't be covered ?
They said that's correct... although they do normally have a quick turnaround of parts.... but flashing BIOS is a risky procedure and if it bricked the Motherboard id have to pay for a new one

Then they really worried me.... they also told me it might also be my processor :0
I asked what ? you are telling my that flashing my motherboards BIOS to the latest version could kill my CPU as well as brick the motherboard ? That just sounds crazy to me (ive never heard of that)

I have asked the question of Gigabyte support too... enquiring if using the built in Q-FLASH method to update to their latest BIOS file, can not only brick their motherboards... but also if its possible that this could kill the Processor.
I've also asked if they do in fact cover the Motherboard for 3 years and How I can check if my one is still under warranty.

I guess Ill check first... but worst case scenario is I return this and they tell me I need to buy a new Motherboard and a new CPU just to have my £2000+ and 2 and a half year old PC working again.

*panic

 

[BlessedSquirrel]

well, I phoned Tech support.... now Im REALLY worried :/

As expected I will need to send it in, apparently they can send me packaging at a cost too if I need it so that's all fine.

I queried though... I bought this PC in August 2015 (with a Gold Warranty)
So This says parts for 2 years and Labour for 3 years.

Now while labour should be covered... I mentioned I read that Gigabyte cover their Motherboards for 3 years... is that correct ?
Im told they would need to check... it depends.... regardless when I bought the PC... it would depend on when THEY bought the motherboard.
I confirmed... so if it had been sitting on your shelves for 6 months...before you sold me the PC... you are saying it wouldn't be covered ?
They said that's correct... although they do normally have a quick turnaround of parts.... but flashing BIOS is a risky procedure and if it bricked the Motherboard id have to pay for a new one

Then they really worried me.... they also told me it might also be my processor :0
I asked what ? you are telling my that flashing my motherboards BIOS to the latest version could kill my CPU as well as brick the motherboard ? That just sounds crazy to me (ive never heard of that)

I have asked the question of Gigabyte support too... enquiring if using the built in Q-FLASH method to update to their latest BIOS file, can not only brick their motherboards... but also if its possible that this could kill the Processor.
I've also asked if they do in fact cover the Motherboard for 3 years and How I can check if my one is still under warranty.

I guess Ill check first... but worst case scenario is I return this and they tell me I need to buy a new Motherboard and a new CPU just to have my £2000+ and 2 and a half year old PC working again.

*panic

I wouldn't panic just yet.

I would have thought the processor frying would be an absolute worst case scenario.

Hope you get some feedback soon.

 

[Warbloke]

Well - feedback from Gigsbyte was fast (me having explained to them what I was told by PCSpecialist Tech support phone call)


there response:
"Gigabyte motherboard has 3 years standard warranty based on the Serial Number or sales invoice.
Please note that because updating BIOS has potential risk, please do it with caution! GBT is not responsible for damages of system because of incorrect manipulation of updating BIOS to avoid any claims from end-users.

Gigabyte QFlash Utility do not killed the CPU. "


So despite their questionable grammar - I guess from this the Manufacturer disagrees that their update process can kill the processor.
While I would fully agree with 'GBT is not responsible for damages of system because of incorrect manipulation of updating BIOS'

Then id argue the reverse should also be true.... GBT IS/ should be - responsible for damages of system because of CORRECT manipulation of updating BIOS.

The Q-FLASH process is a built in feature of the motherboard. You cant really do it 'incorrectly'.
Download the latest BIOS for your model of Motherboard, put on a USB. Boot the PC up and press END during post.
Choose to update the BIOS from a disk... browse to your USB drive.
It finds the BIOS update.... VALIDATES the file before doing it.... then updates.
There is literally no part of this I can imagine doing incorrectly... therefore If I did everything correctly... I feel Gigabyte should be responsible.

 

[Warbloke]

* Their response

[rollinglaugh] Ignore my own questionable grammar

 

[Warbloke]

Well, I paid £15 for PC Specialist to send me a big box. Then another £35 for the collection and delivery.
Its packed up and awaiting collection on Monday 26th March.

... we wait.

 

[BlessedSquirrel]

Well, I paid £15 for PC Specialist to send me a big box. Then another £35 for the collection and delivery.
Its packed up and awaiting collection on Monday 26th March.

... we wait.

Wishing you all the best with it. Keep us posted.

 

[Warbloke]

latest is good news... then immediate bad news

PCS sent the motherboard back to Gigabyte via RMA (as it was under the 3 year manufacturers warranty) - they fixed it and returned it.
(Gigabyte therefore accepting this was not caused by 'a user issue', and something wrong that I did to it)

Now PCS is telling me my CPU is dead... likely that one thing failing caused the other.

I called in, as I was aware that Intel also has a 3 year manufacturers warranty... but was advise yes they do... however PCS don't buy boxed CPUs from Intel - they buy trays, therefore you don't get the expected 3 years... only 1 year.
I guess that's disappointing to hear that if you buy a PC with an Intel CPU that you don't get the expected 3 year manufacturers warranty you expect on in Intel CPU
I guess that is what is, and cant do anything about that - but maybe this point should be made crystal clear to customers at the point of buying from PCS so that we can make an informed choice and know we wont get the warranty cover we would expect.

Ive been told I can either source my own CPU, or upgrade the PC (meaning I need to buy a whole new CPU AND a whole new motherboard again as PCS don't have any X series CPUs any more.
They said that the CPU was faulty too when it arrived, and once the Motherboard was replaced, that fault was still there.
I asked if a claim against Gigabyte be done then if one caused the other... but was told the fault might have been unrelated :/ (seriously)

Now - I do not accept that both the CPU and Motherboard completely died at the exact moment in time (when the motherboard BIOS was flashed) , for completely unrelated reasons.... that's just absurd and beyond reasonable.
Its much more likely that the motherboard failure (which Gigabyte accepted) caused the CPU to fail.

This £3K PC is 2.5 years old.
I've asked PCS to contact Intel regardless in the first instance - I see even now on Amazon this same CPU is £585 + delivery (sold by Intel)
Obviously it cost more than that new, and to have such an expensive component fail, after only 2.5 years to the point in needs to be completely replaced, to me means that was not a reasonable quality component for sale.
Sometimes if you put this to a Manufacturer, they might help.... given they might have some have pride in their quality, and a reasonable person would say that is not reasonable quality to have lasted such a short time.
At the very least, Id like them to look at it, and report on it as to what's wrong with it.
Id expect this report could be used in a claim against Gigabyte if its deemed the motherboard failure killed the CPU to try to recover cost.

I certainly don't expect to have to invest (at least) another £600 to fix a 2.5 year old PC that cost me nearly £3k just to have it working again - given I did not to anything 'wrong' with it.
Especially when the components in it 'should' be under a 3 year warranty... only apparently not due to the way PCS purchase CPUs.
I imagine in fairness, most PC building companies might buy them like this, its probably much cheaper to buy in bulk, tray CPUs than even Bulk Boxed CPUS, therefore when they are sold to us customers it makes more profit.

Im waiting now on the result of that... sigh

 

[ubuysa]

I understand your frustration and disappointment but I think your claim that because Intel offer a three-year warranty on CPUs you buy from them, then PCS should offer the same warranty, is unlikely to succeed. In the terms and conditions, section 15.3 says:

Entire Agreement: This Agreement constitutes the entire agreement between you and us. No other terms whether expressed or implied shall form part of this Agreement. In the event of any conflict between these Terms and Conditions and any other term or provision, these Terms and Conditions shall prevail.

And in relation to that, section 7.1 says:

In addition to any warranty that you may have purchased with your Goods, all Goods that we supply are warranted free from defects for 12 months from the date of supply. This warranty does not affect your statutory rights as a consumer.

What I believe that means is that regardless of any warranty that any component manufacturer may offer, PCS only warrant their builds for 12 months (unless you buy an extended warranty). It's worth asking nicely though whether PCS might try to help you out here, though if they have none of your CPUs in stock and no plans to order any more I don't really see what else they could do?

 

[BlessedSquirrel]

I called in, as I was aware that Intel also has a 3 year manufacturers warranty... but was advise yes they do... however PCS don't buy boxed CPUs from Intel - they buy trays, therefore you don't get the expected 3 years... only 1 year.
I guess that's disappointing to hear that if you buy a PC with an Intel CPU that you don't get the expected 3 year manufacturers warranty you expect on in Intel CPU
I guess that is what is, and cant do anything about that - but maybe this point should be made crystal clear to customers at the point of buying from PCS so that we can make an informed choice and know we wont get the warranty cover we would expect.

This is the difference between OEM and Retail warranties. PCS are an OEM partner and the chips will be OEM chips with 1 year warranty.

A Retail chip which comes fully boxed will have 3 years.

There's similar confusion on places like Amazon where people buy OEM chips expecting normal warranty and getting dismayed when they're told the actual warranty.

 

[Oussebon]

I see even now on Amazon this same CPU is £585 + delivery (sold by Intel)

Be careful here

The product is by Intel. The seller is actually "Bora-Computer GbR." or another marketplace seller.

Note that manufacturers may not honour warranties on items sold from outlets other than authorised resellers. i.e. you would expect to get your full warranty if you bought an Intel CPU from Amazon themselves, but may get no warranty at all if you buy it off a marketplace seller. I believe this is generally the case where the warranty applies only to the original owner.

So as well as the OEM versus retail warning from Spyder above, be aware that if you buy from non-official sellers you might find you get no warranty.

This £3K PC is 2.5 years old.
I've asked PCS to contact Intel regardless in the first instance - I see even now on Amazon this same CPU is £585 + delivery (sold by Intel)
Obviously it cost more than that new, and to have such an expensive component fail, after only 2.5 years to the point in needs to be completely replaced, to me means that was not a reasonable quality component for sale.
Sometimes if you put this to a Manufacturer, they might help.... given they might have some have pride in their quality, and a reasonable person would say that is not reasonable quality to have lasted such a short time.
At the very least, Id like them to look at it, and report on it as to what's wrong with it.
Id expect this report could be used in a claim against Gigabyte if its deemed the motherboard failure killed the CPU to try to recover cost.

It's certainly worth trying, and I don't seem a downside to doing so. If PCS are supporting you in that, then that is also positive. As the others above, however, I'm not sanguine about the odds of success in having Intel or Gigabyte hand over a replacement CPU.

If this is unsuccessful, can I suggest an alternative to buying a new 5930k?

Which would be to buy an AMD Ryzen 7 2700x (and X470 motherboard). The gaming performance is similar, while in other tasks Ryzen is anywhere from having a slight edge over the 5930k to demolishing it:
https://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/1316?vs=2110

It would also be cheaper (~£280 for the CPU, £120 for the mobo, so ~£400 or a bit more). You'd also get access to some newer features your older motherboard doesn't have (support for PCIe NVMe M.2 SSDs, USB 3.1 Gen 2). And perhaps above all, you'd have a mobo and CPU with brand new warranties.
I'm assuming you can use the same RAM, though do double check the mobo compatibility. AMD have also indicated that future gens of CPU will be compatible on AM4 motherboards like the X470 series.

Not that this fixes your dead CPU or makes your situation any less bad luck, but it would at least be cheaper and give you a bit of an upgrade versus buying a new 5930k - and might offer some small consolation in that regard.

 

[Warbloke]

You are all correct, I guess its often the case when you dig into terms and conditions there is often something in there that means you don't get what you expected.

Right now, PCS say they drafted an email to Gigabyte to see if they will accept responsibility for damaging the CPU and we are waiting on their answer.

My position is that since they repaired/ replaced the motherboard under manufacturers warranty (therefore accepting there was no fault caused by the user (me)... then if 'I' did nothing wrong other than use the PC and upgrade things in the correct way... and their motherboard broke my CPU... then they should assume responsibility.

To pre-empt their response... should they say that upgrading the BIOS (which resulted in the motherboard failure) in no way can damage a CPU and they therefore don't accept liability....
then this needs to go to Intel next.

Regardless of PCS's purchasing terms and what warranty they get... I as a consumer still expect to have purchased something from PCS that was of a reasonable quality for sale under the sale of goods act.
Given the cost of the CPU, no reasonable person would say this should only last 2.5 years, and if it fails catastrophically through no user error and no other hardware 'caused' it to fail (should Gigabyte claim they did not cause it)
Then I am left with the situation that the CPU that was in my PC, clearly was of a poor quality.

Even out of warranty, perhaps Intel will accept that their CPUs should last more than 2.5 years, calling into question the quality of this particular CPU.
If they say no... our CPUs only last 2.5 years... then I will leave it to anyone who reads this to think carefully if they want to use an Intel CPU.

The retailer too... in this case PCS has a responsibility in this too, and my contract of sale is with them.
If no one accepts responsibility and its clearly already been accepted that I did nothing wrong... on a matter of principle, Id feel screwed over having spent so much on a PC for it to have lasted only this long.

As you point out... I didn't buy a CPU... I bought a system.
Right now that system does not work at all.
I expect the system to work more than 2.5 years.
If it cant... the system I was sold was clearly not of a reasonable quality for sale.

I am hopeful I don't have to go down this road.
We shall see.

 

[Warbloke]

Be careful here

The product is by Intel. The seller is actually "Bora-Computer GbR." or another marketplace seller.

Note that manufacturers may not honour warranties on items sold from outlets other than authorised resellers. i.e. you would expect to get your full warranty if you bought an Intel CPU from Amazon themselves, but may get no warranty at all if you buy it off a marketplace seller. I believe this is generally the case where the warranty applies only to the original owner.

So as well as the OEM versus retail warning from Spyder above, be aware that if you buy from non-official sellers you might find you get no warranty.



It's certainly worth trying, and I don't seem a downside to doing so. If PCS are supporting you in that, then that is also positive. As the others above, however, I'm not sanguine about the odds of success in having Intel or Gigabyte hand over a replacement CPU.

If this is unsuccessful, can I suggest an alternative to buying a new 5930k?

Which would be to buy an AMD Ryzen 7 2700x (and X470 motherboard). The gaming performance is similar, while in other tasks Ryzen is anywhere from having a slight edge over the 5930k to demolishing it:
https://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/1316?vs=2110

It would also be cheaper (~£280 for the CPU, £120 for the mobo, so ~£400 or a bit more). You'd also get access to some newer features your older motherboard doesn't have (support for PCIe NVMe M.2 SSDs, USB 3.1 Gen 2). And perhaps above all, you'd have a mobo and CPU with brand new warranties.
I'm assuming you can use the same RAM, though do double check the mobo compatibility. AMD have also indicated that future gens of CPU will be compatible on AM4 motherboards like the X470 series.

Not that this fixes your dead CPU or makes your situation any less bad luck, but it would at least be cheaper and give you a bit of an upgrade versus buying a new 5930k - and might offer some small consolation in that regard.

I appreciate that advice - thank you.
I think certainly if it came to it, where I had to invest so much money again on such an expensive PC that's only 2.5 years old.... just to have it working again, the likelihood I would want to buy another Gigabyte motherboard... if updating their BIOS can kill the CPU.
(This I assume must be common as it was practically the first thing PCS support mentioned to me as soon as I told them about the motherboard)

If it did not cause it... then Gigabyte is off the hook, and I wouldn't want an Intel CPU... as they apparently only last 2.5 years and fail all by themselves through no user error or other hardware failure.

Its one situation or the other... :/

I wonder which is the case.
Really the chip will maybe need to go back to Intel for them to investigate.
Intel and Gigabyte might need to argue with each other who is responsible.

Unlimitedly, my contract is with PCS and its their responsibility to have sold me a 'system' that was of reasonable quality for sale.
It cost a lot... it failed after 2.5 years and does not work now at all.
Clearly this was not reasonable quality given the cost of the 'system'
they have a responsibility.

the terms and conditions they put in place does not affect my rights... it also says that right there on those conditions.