What would you do? Inferno or Amazon

[Milkybarkid]

My husband, bless him, is a bit of a technophobe but at 3 score years and 10 plus a few more, I suppose to be expected. However, 3 years ago I bought him a netbook to encourage him. After a couple of months he got the hang of it and now uses it every day for reading newspapers etc., Ebay and fishing pages although he does use Skype. Nothing else, he's not interested in email, writing letters or anything else. The netbook now runs Windows 7 and the ram has been upgraded. He's now getting a bit impatient when it runs slowly and Skype doesn't help although I've turned the camera off.

My question is, do I buy him something like the Inferno (for Christmas) which will be small (he likes small) but powerful even on the lowest spec or spend less because of lack of all round use and get something from Amazon for a couple of hundred pounds less.

 

[keynes]

For those uses I'd suggest an iPad or something similar. No need for an inferno if he is not going to do any gaming.

 

[ubuysa]

If turning the camera off improves the quality of the Skype calls I'd suspect your Internet connection rather than the netbook. What bandwidth do you have on your Internet connection?

 

[dogbot]

My husband, bless him, is a bit of a technophobe but at 3 score years and 10 plus a few more, I suppose to be expected.

Can we have less swearing in here please, I'm 75 and still with it and I expect he thinks he is too.

So the old netbook is running a bit slow? Has it had any Windows 7 maintenance done on it since W7 was installed? Using clean up to remove the old newspapers might help as would removing stale fishing bait from between the keys. However, I'm guessing you know a bit about computers yourself or you would not be here so perhaps that's not the problem.

I agree with Keynes that a pad is a viable alternative but if his eyesight is anything like mine it would need to be a large one. It also depends how he likes to read. Does he like the netbook on his lap or would our downtrodden hero prefer to sit in your armchair holding a pad.

The choice of a netbook or pad is difficult at the present time. Intel (and I think AMD) are introducing the next generation of power efficient processors. If you are not anticipating buying until christmas then it might be better to look at the state of the market around November time. Beware of those with Windows 8, that would really dumbfound him.

 

[Grimezy]

If he's purely using it for browsing the web with very little else then I would suggest looking into a Samsung Chromebook. Extremely quick boot up times (7 seconds from cold to get onto the web or instant if you just shut the lid) and it runs on a stripped back operating system which is effectively just a chrome browser on the laptop.

If you do look into them, do your research, they are not a laptop/netbook. A netbook is a small laptop trying to run an operating system too powerful for it when realistically people only use them to browse or word process. A chromebook is the size of a netbook but is trying to run a lot less on it's operating system compared to Windows. Downsides are that it pretty much always needs to be online (although a lot of apps are bringing out offline modes) and also you can't install anything onto it or run discs on it. Advantage of that being that it'll never slow down because you're effectively not installing any rubbish onto it as it's all being run through a browser and stored on the cloud.

I have one as a secondary computer and it meets all my expectations and performs brilliantly. Just make sure you understand what it is before you buy one because it is a completely different experience to a regular laptop... Not a hard change, just a different change!

Edit: Forgot to mention, as far as I know they haven't brought Skype out on the Chrome Web Store (you can view all the apps on your current pc by opening Chrome and clicking the webstore in the bottom right corner, you can even try them out without needing a chrome machine). Google does have its own version of video chatting on Google+ (it's called hangouts) but if he's more keen on using Skype then a Chromebook might not be ideal!

 

[Milkybarkid]

Thanks for the suggestions. Ipad out, no way would he let me give money to Apple, he's got very clear views on that, and he does like a keyboard. Chrome, I'm not too keen on as I don't like the browser and he likes using Mozilla. I'm using Windows 8 and to be honest I don't know what the fuss is about and I think it would suit the way he uses a pc. Boots up fast and closes down even faster. I use Skype and don't have a problem with it so I don't think it is the bandwidth which is around 11.5mb and he doesn't have a problem with videos (I wondered why I was suddenly exceeding my limit each month). Between my laptop dying and getting a new one, I used the netbook and I found that using it seemed to perk it up, same with my old desktop which is connected to the printer and scanner. Sluggish at first and then perks up with a bit of use. He generally only uses it between 8 in the morning and 10, sometimes earlier, whereas as I'm on and off all day (I can't sit and do nothing).

I went for a cheap netbook initially because I thought he might not use it, (like the Olympus camera bought last year and the Windows phone at Christmas, he still likes his old Nokia, although I'm not a phone fan). I suspect if I try and involve him in the purchase he will just go for the cheapest. His perch is usually at the kitchen worktop where the netbook just fits in nicely on the drop down 'eating' piece. He doesn't want a bigger screen, never uses mine or wants to and when he had to wait a couple of hours for a relative in hospital outpatients, wouldn't take it with him because he didn't want to look a prat. He just likes things to work fast, and I'm with him on that.

 

[Grimezy]

I'm not 100% clued up on netbooks but do they offer any with an SSD as a primary hard drive? This would greatly speed up boot times and desktop use and if he installed skype onto the SSD then that should also improve (providing it's not a connection issue that is causing skype to slow down). If speed is key I'd also try and get him into Windows 8 as like you said, it is noticeably quicker to boot up and smoother on desktop use. I heard they'd brought out an update that effectively turns it back into the Windows 7 layout if he doesn't like change.

 

[tom_gr7]

I've got an old netbook and recently installed an SSD it in. But its still a bit slow, because the cpu is very low end and it only has 2gb ram (cant upgrade further than 2gb)

I'd suggest going for a 14inch Ultra book from PCS http://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/notebooks/ultraNote/

not too much bigger than a netbook, but a nice ssd in there along with 8gig of ram, and a good dual core cpu you have a very very fast smallish laptop.

Chassis & Display
UltraNote: 14" Glossy HD LED Backlit Widescreen (1366x768)
Processor (CPU)
Intel® Core™i5 Dual Core Mobile Processor i5-3230M (2.60GHz) 3MB
Memory (RAM)
8GB SAMSUNG 1333MHz SODIMM DDR3 MEMORY (1 x 8GB)
Graphics Card
Intel® HD Graphics 4000 Video Memory Technology up to 1.7GB
Memory - Hard Disk
120GB KINGSTON HYPERX 3K SSD, SATA 6 Gb/s (upto 555MB/sR | 510MB/sW)
DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
Ultra Slim 8x SATA DVD±R/RW/Dual Layer (+ 24x CD-RW)
Memory Card Reader
Internal 9 in 1 Card Reader (MMC/RSMMC/SD: Mini, XC & HC/MS: Pro & Duo)
Thermal Paste
STANDARD THERMAL PASTE FOR SUFFICIENT COOLING
Sound Card
Intel 2 Channel High Definition Audio + MIC/Headphone Jack
Bluetooth & Wireless
GIGABIT LAN & WIRELESS INTEL® N-2230 (300Mbps) + BLUETOOTH
USB Options
2 x USB 3.0 PORTS + 1 x USB 2.0 PORT AS STANDARD
Battery
UltraNote Series 6 Cell Lithium Ion Battery (62.16WH) (Up to 7 Hours)
Power Lead & Adaptor
1 x UK Power Lead & 65W AC Adaptor
Operating System
Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit w/SP1 - inc DVD & Licence (£79)
Office Software
FREE 30 Day Trial of Microsoft® Office® 365
Anti-Virus
BULLGUARD INTERNET SECURITY - FREE 90 DAY TRIAL
Keyboard Language
ULTRANOTE SERIES UK KEYBOARD
Notebook Mouse
INTEGRATED 2 BUTTON TOUCHPAD MOUSE
Webcam
INTEGRATED 2.0 MEGAPIXEL WEBCAM
Warranty
3 Year Silver Warranty (1 Year Collect & Return, 1 Year Parts, 3 Year Labour) (£5)
Intel Anti-Theft Technology
FREE 90 Day Intel Anti-Theft Trial - Prevent Data Access upon Theft
Insurance
1 Month Free Laptop Insurance inc. Accidental Damage & Theft
Delivery
STANDARD INSURED DELIVERY TO UK MAINLAND (MON-FRI)
Build Time
Standard Build - Approximately 9 to 11 working days
Quantity
1

Price: £587.00 including VAT and delivery.

Unique URL to re-configure: http://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/quotes/ultraNote/qEF07MUMuU/

 

[mdwh]

I love my netbook, I say it's a shame that the options have disappeared - I too don't want a tablet. Well, I'm likely to get the new Nexus 7, but more as an in-between netbook and phone, and as a programming toy - I don't expect it to replace my netbook, and have no interest in 10" pure tablets that you have to hold with both hands and somehow use at the same time. Even when all I'm doing is using the web, I want something with a keyboard, and something that works on my lap or table without me having to hold it, or lay it down flat.

The main advantage that netbooks and tablets have (as well as low cost) is long battery life, and that's the thing that the low end laptops won't have - if he's not bothered about that (e.g., especially if using it mainly at home), then I'd say go for a small laptop (such as the Inferno, but I don't know whether an Inferno would be better than other alternative laptops).

Chromebooks have the advantage of being cheaper as you're not paying the Windows licence fee, but if he wants Windows there's less advantage in my opinion. I disagree with the comment that Chromebooks are the size of netbooks. Netbooks came in at 10" or less - in general, Chromebooks are not as small, though there is an 11.6" one which is almost as small, but then so is the Inferno.

I also feel that tablets have the same performance problems as netbooks, compared to "proper" Intel Core or AMD laptops in my opinion - perhaps people notice it less because they are upgrading them more often, but I've seen phones/tablets go slow with time as applications become more complex or they receive the latest OS update, just as much as netbooks. They're both slow when you do the same thing (e.g., open loads of tabs in a browser), it's just that people have lower expectations of phones/tablets, and try to use netbooks like a full blown PC. They're both slow to boot too (my netbook actually boots slightly faster than my Galaxy Nexus; both are beaten hands down by my Vortex 3 with Windows 8 which boots in 13s).

Netbooks are helped sometimes if you search for software that's more optimised for lower performance. I know you said he likes Mozilla, but it might be worth trying other browsers to see if they're any faster (e.g., Chrome?)

Although yes, netbooks now have the problem that new ones aren't appearing, so the hardware is now getting more outdated, but that's the hardware, not that tablet software magically makes things faster. It would be nice to get a netbook that's 10" screen, the latest Atom Clover Trail CPU, 2GB or more RAM, a decent resolution, and choice of SSD, but it doesn't exist. The closest are the new Windows 8 hybrid laptop/tablets, and although some do look very nice, they are more expensive, as well as being at least 11.6" in almost all cases, so again, if you don't need the battery life and just want a laptop, it's better to stick with a normal laptop.

I agree that an SSD would make things much faster (though more of a pain to upgrade and transfer/re-install everything). Windows 8 might work faster, but probably best to research how well it does on netbooks.

"Beware of those with Windows 8, that would really dumbfound him."

And an ipad would be even more of a difference, but if he wants to stick with the Windows 7 start menu, that can be fixed easily with one of the many free tools that change the start menu to any previous version of Windows. (And note that his applications will run just the same as before - the new Windows 8 UI is only for new Windows 8-only applications from the Microsoft download store).

"Forgot to mention, as far as I know they haven't brought Skype out on the Chrome Web Store"

I tried out ChromeOS on a virtual machine - I was disappointed that almost every application I tried on the Chrome Web Store didn't work, as it required a native plugin only available for Windows (or perhaps also OS X, Linux)(!). This was a few months ago, I don't know if Google have started cleaning it up, or making it clearer what works on ChromeOS (as opposed to Chrome the browser).

---

In summary, I'd say that your original idea of getting a "proper" small laptop is spot on, so the original question remains as to whether to get the Inferno, or an alternative laptop...

 

[Grimezy]

I tried out ChromeOS on a virtual machine - I was disappointed that almost every application I tried on the Chrome Web Store didn't work, as it required a native plugin only available for Windows (or perhaps also OS X, Linux)(!). This was a few months ago, I don't know if Google have started cleaning it up, or making it clearer what works on ChromeOS (as opposed to Chrome the browser).

I believe they have cleared up most issues now, their web store is much more focused on ChromeOS devices rather than just being used on normal devices using chrome so most things are compatible and don't require additional plugins. Saying that, a Chromebook is not meant to perform like a laptop or a tablet in the sense that apps aren't actually apps, they're programs that can be run through the browser. Some people see this as a negative but realistically all a Chromebook is is a browser so if you understand that it's not too big of an issue.

I don't agree entirely with your comment on them not having many advantages over an equivalent netbook. Obviously if he wants Windows he wants Windows, there's no getting round that and obviously a netbook would be the obvious choice. If he wants a device to browse the web on and do general tasks then I'd have to give a Chromebook the upper hand. Built in SSD, fast boot times, runs off the cloud, rapid browsing, built in anti-virus, no maintenance required at all and not having to handle Windows' demanding nature are all big advantages. Like you said, people try to use netbooks like a full blown PC when the components can't handle it. A chromebook knows that it won't be able to handle that sort of usage so has built itself around the audience it is targeting.

I'm not trying to force a Chromebook onto anyone, I just think they've developed a lot in the last year or so and that people give too much of a negative impression of them when they maybe haven't even used one personally. For his needs, it sounds like it could be ideal. "Ebay and fishing pages although he does use Skype. Nothing else, he's not interested in email, writing letters or anything else". Okay it won't have Skype but they have an equivalent and no doubt Skype will come over to ChromeOS at some point anyway. Apart from that she's described everything a Chromebook was made for.

Price of Tom's prospective build - £587.00
Samsung Chromebook - £211.00

 

[Milkybarkid]

Upgrading is not an option for something that is 3 years old in December (bought from Morgan Computers so probably not the latest model at the time) and cost less than £200. Inferno was selected because of size although I had looked at the Ultranote. I'm not going to buy something that I wouldn't use myself and I'm a big believer in you get what you pay for. Regardless of what some people might think, I do like Windows, I've never had a problem with it and the latest version might not be to everyone's taste but it is fast where it matters. The menu would really suit him, click and you are there. He might even use email it's so easy. The netbook got him interested and I am really pleased about that.

I had better start saving.

 

[mdwh]

I believe they have cleared up most issues now, their web store is much more focused on ChromeOS devices rather than just being used on normal devices using chrome so most things are compatible and don't require additional plugins.

That's good to hear.

I don't agree entirely with your comment on them not having many advantages over an equivalent netbook. Obviously if he wants Windows he wants Windows, there's no getting round that and obviously a netbook would be the obvious choice. If he wants a device to browse the web on and do general tasks then I'd have to give a Chromebook the upper hand. Built in SSD, fast boot times, runs off the cloud, rapid browsing, built in anti-virus, no maintenance required at all and not having to handle Windows' demanding nature are all big advantages. Like you said, people try to use netbooks like a full blown PC when the components can't handle it. A chromebook knows that it won't be able to handle that sort of usage so has built itself around the audience it is targeting.

The problem is what the person knows rather than the laptop - a person might be annoyed that a netbook isn't as fast as another laptop when they try to do something, but similarly, they might be annoyed that the Chromebook can't do that thing at all.

Fair enough about the advantages, I agree it's worth looking at as an option for someone who just wants to do web browsing, and I'm glad to see new alternatives that are laptops with keyboards rather than big phones (Though note that Windows 8 has anti-virus built in too, there are of course Windows laptops with built-in SSD - but I guess the main issue is Chromebooks can get away with smaller cheap SSDs - and cloud support is easy to set up, especially in Windows 8.)