New PC suddenly not booting up

[Xenny]

Hi all, wondered if anyone could help.

I recently received a brand new PC from PCS last Saturday and the PC was working perfectly fine from day 1 with no issues, used it every single day since getting it, it would boot up pretty much instantly and was impressed with the speed actually. I have not altered any settings at all and not touched anything but yesterday morning the PC wouldn't boot up, the icue water cooler would turn on and light up and icue fans would turn on and light and the rgb ram would light up but the rgb case fans would start spinning but not light up at all.
I would wait a while to see if it would eventually come on but when it didn't I would turn the power off and even turn the power off at the PSU and try rebooting again but it still would not boot up. I did this at least 5 times and eventually the PC started up as normal. I was on it last night and turned it off and went to bed.
This morning the same problem again, it wouldn't boot up, kept restarting it and eventually after several attempts it's booted up. This time I noticed that the times it was not booting up there were two red lights on the motherboard right next to the ram and the light would flash one to the other, sort of alternating flashing.

Does anyone know what the issue could be?
My PC specs are as follows:

Case
PCS PRISM II ARGB MID TOWER CASE (PWM)
Processor (CPU)
AMD Ryzen 9 7950X 16 Core CPU (4.5GHz-5.7GHz/80MB CACHE/AM5)
Motherboard
GIGABYTE X670 AORUS ELITE AX (AM5, DDR5, PCIe 4.0, Wi-Fi 6E)
Memory (RAM)
64GB Corsair VENGEANCE RGB DDR5 6000MHz (2 x 32GB)
Graphics Card
16GB ASUS PROART GEFORCE RTX 4080 SUPER - HDMI, DP, LHR
1st M.2 SSD Drive
4TB SAMSUNG 990 PRO M.2, PCIe 4.0 NVMe (up to 7450MB/R, 6900MB/W)
1st M.2 SSD Drive
4TB SAMSUNG 990 PRO M.2, PCIe 4.0 NVMe (up to 7450MB/R, 6900MB/W)
Power Supply
CORSAIR 850W RMx SERIES™ MODULAR 80 PLUS® GOLD, ULTRA QUIET
Processor Cooling
CORSAIR iCUE H100i ELITE LCD XT RGB CPU Cooler
Thermal Paste
ARCTIC MX-4 EXTREME THERMAL CONDUCTIVITY COMPOUND

Thanks.

 

[SpyderTracks]

Unfortunately it's not properly designed, the cooler is nowhere near appropriate for the CPU, nor is the case or the PSU.

The symptoms would relate to a CPU issue.

 

[Xenny]

Unfortunately it's not properly designed, the cooler is nowhere near appropriate for the CPU, nor is the case or the PSU.

The symptoms would relate to a CPU issue.

The CPU hasn't even gone above 40c and the CPU usage hasn't even gone above 10% yet because the only thing I've done with this PC do far is use the web, I've still not even had time to properly utilise it yet and when I do come to utilise it I will be putting limits on the CPU to keep the temps down. So I don't see how the CPU is the issue due to my cooling cos it's not even got out of the gate yet and it's still booting after several attempts and works fine after booting.

 

[SpyderTracks]

The CPU hasn't even gone above 40c and the CPU usage hasn't even gone above 10% yet because the only thing I've done with this PC do far is use the web, I've still not even had time to properly utilise it yet and when I do come to utilise it I will be putting limits on the CPU to keep the temps down. So I don't see how the CPU is the issue due to my cooling cos it's not even got out of the gate yet and it's still booting after several attempts and works fine after booting.

Not much more I can say. It’s not suitably designed and won’t work properly

there's no point troubleshooting further than that as the design isn’t enough to support the system

 

[Xenny]

Like I said, the temp has not gone above 40, usage never above 10%, it's currently booted up and working fine. What you're suggesting as the problem just doesn't add up. But thanks for your time anyway.

 

[SpyderTracks]

Like I said, the temp has not gone above 40, usage never above 10%, it's currently booted up and working fine. What you're suggesting as the problem just doesn't add up. But thanks for your time anyway.

I appreciate you’re saying that but that’s an impossibility.

its not something we can advise on with that configuration until the platform is suitably designed.

 

[Xenny]

I may have managed to troubleshoot this myself anyway, I went into BIOS and noticed it was using XMP and there was no EXPO available. XMP profiles are designed for intel optimisation not AMD so this ram is not optimised for AM5 and AM5 is notorious for having RAM issues.

This was actually one of my fears when choosing the RAM from the parts picker because the information on the exact ram and their specs is limited so I was keeping my fingers crossed it was going to be the EXPO version of the vengeance but clearly it isn't.

Anyway, I have turned off XMP and I'm running the ram at 4800 instead of 6000 and so far the PC has successfully booted from being powered off. I've turned off an booted up multiple times now with no issues.

The BIOS version is up to date so I don't understand why the platform should still be having RAM issue this many years after release.

 

[SpyderTracks]

I may have managed to troubleshoot this myself anyway, I went into BIOS and noticed it was using XMP and there was no EXPO available. XMP profiles are designed for intel optimisation not AMD so this ram is not optimised for AM5 and AM5 is notorious for having RAM issues.

This was actually one of my fears when choosing the RAM from the parts picker because the information on the exact ram and their specs is limited so I was keeping my fingers crossed it was going to be the EXPO version of the vengeance but clearly it isn't.

Anyway, I have turned off XMP and I'm running the ram at 4800 instead of 6000 and so far the PC has successfully booted from being powered off. I've turned off an booted up multiple times now with no issues.

The BIOS version is up to date so I don't understand why the platform should still be having RAM issue this many years after release.

It’s a cpu issue. When applying a RAM overclock, you’re overlocking the cpu memory fabric. XMP works fine with AM5 so long as it’s on XMP RAM.

But you’re not hearing the feedback so I’ll bow out.

 

[Martinr36]

Ok seeing that you only got it last Saturday, I think the general consensus of opinion would be to send it back and get your money back (you can do this within 14 days without giving any reason), while you are waiting for it all to get sorted, have a read of the link below, then post back here with the answers to the questions that are raised:

1. system uses, if gaming involved what type of games
2. Monitor make/model or resolution & refresh rate
3. Budget

Ok I know this doesn't solve your problem, but if you keep with what you have, this is probably going to be the first of many

Please read before posting:- Collaboration of Helpful Hints

NB: These forums are not an official support channel. None of us work for PCS, we're all either customers or techies who just like to help out where possible. For any official support, you need to contact PCS directly either through your PCS account, or via the contact details on the main...

www.pcspecialist.co.uk

 

[Ekans2011]

According to Corsair that RAM kit is fully compatible with both platforms so that shouldn't be an issue.

VENGEANCE® RGB 64GB (2x32GB) DDR5 DRAM 6000MT/s CL30 AMD EXPO Memory Kit

Attain top DDR5 RAM performance optimized for AMD® motherboards, with ten-zone RGB for DDR5 memory that lights up your cutting-edge PC.

www.corsair.com

 

[Xenny]

I would be perfectly happy listening to and accepting your answers if I was running this thing at high temperatures and high usage but I haven't been, I've spent the last few days personalising windows and transferring over apps and files from my previous PC, I have not benchmarked it, not played any games, I have done nothing but web browse. The temps have never gone above 40c and the usage of the CPU has never hone above 10%.
If I've not burdened or overtaxed the CPU yet at all then there is no reason for it to be failing based on my system build, it's barely been above idle the entire week, the only other answer is the CPU is faulty from the absolute start and it's nothing to do with the cooler or case I am using. I am not being stubborn I am being logical, you're all under the impression I am running this thing full blast and the cooler can't handle it and I am telling you I haven't.

 

[TonyCarter]

How long have you left it to start-up when it's had this starting issue? 30 seconds, 2 minutes, 10 minutes?

If it's not extraordinarily long wait (i.e. 10 minutes), then could it be constant memory retraining? I've seen reports of the first round of memory retraining (admittedly on older BIOS version) saying 5 minutes was the norm.

---

I'm not saying your situation is this, as it has already been suggested it could be a build issue, but...

AM5 does seem to do a lot of memory retraining (supposed to do it once and use those settings until something triggers it again), which it does before the computer fully boots...and in some cases mine (Asus X670E + 7800X3D + 32GB 6400MHz RAM) has taken a few minutes for Windows to come up (50-60 second BIOS boot time is my norm). I'm guessing the long boots are where it's found an issue in the memory checks and has rebooted to try again at a lower/slower frequency.

If you keep resetting it, then it will probably retrain again, and start the cycle again...and the combination of 7950X and 64GB RAM will mean the training takes longer than for example a 7600+32GB RAM.

There is something in the BIOS that remembers the last known good memory settings - 'Memory Context Restore' - and when this is set to 'Auto' the BIOS will decide how & when it does the retraining. I think mine was doing it at almost every boot, so I've now gone in and changed my BIOS setting for this feature from 'Auto' to 'Enabled', so that it will keep using the last known good settings (but that may cause issues in itself in future). 'Disabled' turns it off, which forces memory retraining at every boot (you don't want that).

Memory Context Restore (MCR)

Function:
- Preserves memory settings (timings, voltage, etc.) during system shutdown or power loss.
- Allows faster boot times by skipping memory training on subsequent boots.

Some more info on the 7950X slow boot times here...

AMD Ryzen 9 7950X Review - Impressive 16-core Powerhouse

The Ryzen 9 7950X is a monster CPU. When paired with the right workload it will eat even the 12900K for breakfast. As our review shows, the performance uplifts can be massive: +30-50% gen-over-gen is totally possible. What makes things complicated though, is that keeping the beast cool is almost...

www.techpowerup.com

During testing I didn't encounter any major bugs or issues; the whole AM5 / X670 platform works very well considering how many new features it brings; there's one big gotcha though and that's startup duration. When powering on for the first time after a processor install, your system will spend at least a minute with memory training at POST code 15 before the BIOS screen appears. When I first booted up my Zen 4 sample I assumed it was hung and kept resetting/clearing CMOS. After the first boot, the super long startup times improve, but even with everything setup, you'll stare at a blank screen for 30 seconds. To clarify: after a clean system shutdown, without loss of power, when you press the power button you're still looking at a black screen for 30 seconds, before the BIOS logo appears. I find that an incredibly long time, especially when you're not watching the POST code display that tells you something is happening. AMD and the motherboard manufacturers say they are working on improving this—they must. I'm having doubts that your parents would accept such an experience as an "upgrade," considering their previous computer showed something on-screen within seconds after pressing the power button.

 

[Xenny]

How long have you left it to start-up when it's had this starting issue? 30 seconds, 2 minutes, 10 minutes?

If it's not extraordinarily long wait (i.e. 10 minutes), then could it be constant memory retraining? I've seen reports of the first round of memory retraining (admittedly on older BIOS version) saying 5 minutes was the norm.

tbh I probably only waited just over a minute each time. Anyway it's currently booting fine again since I lowered to 4800.
Since everyone thinks my build is inadequate I am going to change and lower the max temp the CPU will run at full load, lower the max speed of the cores and run the ram at 4800 and see how it goes.
It is what it is.

Thanks.

 

[TonyCarter]

tbh I probably only waited just over a minute each time. Anyway it's currently booting fine again since I lowered to 4800.
Since everyone thinks my build is inadequate I am going to change and lower the max temp the CPU will run at full load, lower the max speed of the cores and run the ram at 4800 and see how it goes.
It is what it is.

Thanks.

Well, there's no harm in giving it another try at 6000mzz and waiting a couple of minutes to see if it boots...or gradually increasing the speeds on 200mhz increments to see if it works then...but remember to wait the couple of minutes for a new round of memory retraining each time.

If it still doesn't boot then you know you've got a different issue.

 

[Xenny]

This is an update just as an FYI if anyone else has a similar experience and searches the forums...

As I said yesterday it seemed to be fixed after I altered the ram speed and the PC was booting perfectly fine and was booting super fast but once again this morning I turned on the PC and it didn't seem to boot again so then I figured that this time around I'll wait at least 10 minutes.
After about 2 to 3 minutes the PC booted up fine. As an experiment I did a shutdown, turned the power off, waited a couple of minutes, turned the power on again and turned the PC on again and the PC booted up perfectly fine and very quickly without any delays.

So it seems that changing the memory speed wasn't even necessary and that when I leave the PC powered off for several hours overnight the next morning the PC has to do a lengthy memory train but once it's done I can power off and on again and it wont need to do a lengthy one. The issue therefore is the longer the PC is turned off the more likely there will be a lengthy boot time.

I have already set context memory restore to enabled so that makes no difference to having to do a lengthy morning boot. The cmos battery has to be working fine because all the setting all remain the same so I am honestly confused why having the PC off overnight causes the PC to do a long boot first thing in the morning.

Anyway that's the update.

 

[TonyCarter]

I only turn mine on once a day, so I don’t really notice if it’s 60 seconds or 120 seconds each time…the only way I can check is to look at the startup time in Task Manager afterwards.

Maybe the fact that you’ve got double the memory is causing longer boots, but as I said previously, memory training shouldn’t happen at every boot…and in my case it seemed to be…so I changed that ‘memory context restore’ from auto to enabled in the 2 places I found it, and after the regular 1-2 minute boots it now seems to have settled to 30-50 second boots.

Maybe your’s will settle down further…or accept the 2-5 minute boot as the norm.

 

[Scott]

Couple of minutes can be fairly normal with DDR5 RAM. Nothing to worry about.

I believe my motherboard/RAM also states XMP rather than EXPO, it's compatible with both though so works fine. I did tweak mine manually but certainly the 6000Mhz profile was fine.

When it's time for the next latest and greatest, be sure to pop back and get some advice. The system should be a good performer but it's not well rounded unfortunately (as you are hearing). Always best to get pointers when spending this amount of dosh. Credit for opting for AM5 though, it could be worse