Changing my life, I really need some help!

[BAD SANTA]

Alright everybody,

I really need some advice and don't know if anybody can help me.

When I was at school I was a complete wa?(;er I did not want to learn anything and basically just got into lots of fights and stuff,
Now in the past 7 years or so of meeting my wife to be I have completely changed my life and now it's time to change my job.
I have always done manual jobs like fixing cars fitting cable and delivering but in my private time at home spend almost all of it with the wife to be or glued to my pc/xbox/ and pc again.
Everything I know I have taught myself and enjoyed every single bit of it and now I really want want a decent job involving pc's.
I have just started teaching myself sharepoint by using the sharepoint labs but don't know if this is the best thing to get into as there seems to be a lot of sharepoint haters out there, what do you guys and girls think?
Should I look at trying to learn something different like .net or java?
Any help would really be appreciated also If you have any ideas could you please point me in the right direction for learning these skills.
Thanks,
Adam

 

[Gorman]

Saying that you want to go into IT is very vague, sounds like you are thinking of the programming side, amirite?

Other valid IT 'fields'

Networks
Server Admin
Virtualisation
Support (Front line, back end etc)
General Bod
Web design including backend

 

[LFFPicard]

Hiya,

Like you all my knowledge is self taught, I am still not in the ideal job position but i am working more with computers, unfortunatley unless you have that bit of paper that proves you know it not many companies will hire you for that role.
My current job i started in the warehouse as forklift driver. Then moved into production standing infront of printers and now in the office do dater hadnling, processing and error checking. I only got so far by starting at the bottom and expressing interest in the other areas and offered my knowledge freely.
The only other way you can do it is go back to night school and learn something you want to do. If it is hands on computers then learn networking, and microsoft certified courses. You may also want to look at advanced science or electricals, this helps in other areas of computeing also. That will get you qualifications for the good jobs.

Alternativly you can try and get a simple admin job or work at a printers and apply for a NVQ that are funded by the goverment. Someone will basically come and observe you at work, set you some tasks and get you to do a couple of essays and then you get a NVQ in what ever area it is. I got myself a Retail and Manegment NVQ doing this and am planning on Small Business and Networking NVQ's this year. That should help me move into a more Domain admin role with the bit of paper saying i can do the job.

Best of luck! But remember, it all takes time. I been at my current job 4years in April and only started learning domain admin stuff the last 6months.

 

[Pete]

I'm thinking the other way, IT is a pain in the @rse and i'd be better off being a train driver for twice my current wage.

I currently do Web Dev, mostly VBScript (i know it's still kicking about), Sharepoint (Designer - as i haven't got into C# yet) as well as other random apps stuff. My problem is that i'm stuck in small local government with a wide range of skills but master of none.

checkout the competition for each job - every IT graduate is leaving uni with Java skills i think.

 

[A Fine Frenzy]

Lot's of people I know aren't happy in their current jobs, and want a change of career altogether. Easier than done though what with the current state of affairs. Tough times.

 

[BAD SANTA]

Thanks everybody that has posted so far, some interesting reading but I still have not got a decent answer to my question,
Should I continue with sharepoint and or sidestep towards something else.
Gorman sorry if I was not clear about what I want to do but that's kind of what I am asking you guys as well, I know for sure that I am looking at the programing and web dev side of things and just wanted to know what I need to be aiming for and maybe some steps that I need to take to get me there.
I realise that this is a huge step to be taking hense the title, I am fully motivated and prepared to do almost anything to get there.
I also realise that there are other people out there who are not very happy in there job but I am one of those people that when I have my heart set on something I will get it, also A Fine Frenzy I am a half full kind of guy.

 

[A Fine Frenzy]

That's cool, man. For web coding look to learn php html, javascript. A mate of mine recommends brainbench.com.

 

[DSN]

saying you want to go into IT, is like me walking into NASA and saying I want to do a job with Science.

Start with the basics. look for a 1st line support role, get up to speed on your basic windows/ tcp/ip / and networking knowlege

and go from there.

Although at the moment. Definatly not the easyest industry to get into.

ohh.. and **** sharepoint....

 

[Pete]

ohh.. and **** sharepoint....

hehe, just installing sharepoint is a mind job. not to mention using it for anything than the most basic tasks is like vacuming your eyeball through a straw.

"whats that sharepoint an unexpected error occured ? no sh!t sherlock, care to shed some light on that? no. no?? right i'll trust have a trawl through the logs shall i ?... fvck you very much." :¬)

i'm not bitter or twisted or anything and on occasions (when things work) it can be quite good.

Edit http://suguk.org/default.aspx is a lot of help when starting out.

 

[Gorman]

saying you want to go into IT, is like me walking into NASA and saying I want to do a job with Science.

Start with the basics. look for a 1st line support role, get up to speed on your basic windows/ tcp/ip / and networking knowlege

and go from there.

Although at the moment. Definatly not the easyest industry to get into.

ohh.. and **** sharepoint....

hehe, just installing sharepoint is a mind job. not to mention using it for anything than the most basic tasks is like vacuming your eyeball through a straw.

"whats that sharepoint an unexpected error occured ? no sh!t sherlock, care to shed some light on that? no. no?? right i'll trust have a trawl through the logs shall i ?... fvck you very much." :¬)

i'm not bitter or twisted or anything and on occasions (when things work) it can be quite good.

Edit http://suguk.org/default.aspx is a lot of help when starting out.

Family forum, language guys. That includes quoting offensive language!

Santa, from what i have observed of your posts etc im guessing you are a hands on sort of fella who enjoys a technical challenge. I would avoid the programming / web design side of IT as in my opinion its kind of like the art course of the IT world.

If you want a real challenge with lots of practical work i would look at heading towards the Network / server admin side of things. Some things to remember:

1) outside of major cities, IT pay sucks. No matter this guy whos brother is on £30k etc etc, in general, its a low paid profession, blame computeach etc.
2) Always get certs off your own back or do it through a local college at night class, never, EVER go with computeach and their ilk.
3) As DSN suggests, the best way to start in IT is helpdesk, everyone serves their time in hell.

 

[BAD SANTA]

You are a very perceptive man Gorman, I am a very very practical person and that's exactly what I don't want to be doing anymore lol.
Practical = low paid job where everybody walks all over you and people in suits look down on you.

 

[Gorman]

Well i believe the pure inactivity of programming etc will drive you mad. The physical side of IT such as networks etc can offer a good mix of tech and good old fashioned engineering.

"low paid job where everybody walks all over you and people in suits look down on you"

I'm not talking about myself specifically here, as my boss reads this forum! But you pretty much nailed it on the head there for the entire IT industry, there is a whole generation of people who have been promised a career in IT as they grew up knowing how to use a PC. At the moment its best to specialize in something and be very very good at it to command a decent wage and stand above the masses. Its a very competitive and low paid career path.

And for anyone who may read this, i love my job, please don't sack me.

 

[BAD SANTA]

I really appreciate your honesty and will take on board the info, Having said that
I think I will finish the sharepoint labs anyway and may have to have a think about what I want to do.
Cheers for everybody's input.

 

[Gorman]

Oh god aye finish the sharepoint no matter what, never hurts to have another string in your bow.

 

[Rakk]

Anyways, coming to this conversation way too late, even if you get the relevant qualifications, you'll need to start at the bottom and work your way up.
I do software development and I started in QA (Quality Assurance - i.e. software testing) before working up to getting into development.

But yeah, I like my job, but if you're actively minded then dev may not fit you, and yes people do want stuff done, and they want it done yesterday .....

 

[JSG10]

Sorry to jump in and way off track but Gorman what is this??

specialize

Are you American? If you are... fair enough...ish. But if you are not... how very dare you. Specialise with a Z in? What are you playing at man?! Sort it out.

 

[Phoenix]

And for anyone who may read this, i love my job, please don't sack me.

lol xD

(random text)

 

[vanthus]

Sorry to jump in and way off track but Gorman what is this??



Are you American? If you are... fair enough...ish. But if you are not... how very dare you. Specialise with a Z in? What are you playing at man?! Sort it out.

Specialize looks good to me.

 

[JSG10]

<insert intelligence insulting insult here>

 

[pengipete]

If you want a career in IT and you don't have any contacts or are not already in a company where you are the defacto IT guy then you will struggle without recognised qualifications. Ask yourself, would you go to a self-taught brain surgeon or would you want someone else to test and approve his skills first? If you are serious about persuing a career in IT, you need to start with the most basic questions - the same ones that apply to any occupation that has a limited number of places and is almost certainly not going to provide on-the-job training.

As much as I admire your ambition, as you've asked for honest advice I can only tell you that what you are considering should be looked at in far more detail - like a business plan rather than a choice of graphics card to play the latest games. Start at the very begining - do you have any idea how many potential posts there are for someone with the skills you are aiming for? If so, do you know how many vacancies there are every month - maybe even every year - in the area you can reasonably travel to work? If the answer is less than at least two a month, are you prepared to move house to a locale with more vacancies or are you willing and able to spend months either earning no money or doing another job to stay afloat. If that happens, can you guarantee to keep up to date with new releases - bearing in mind the costs involved as well as finding the time after working 8-10 hours a day. Even if a vacancy arises every day, is there anything you can put on your CV to compensate for the fact that everyone else applying has passed exams and probably has years of experience in a related field - in other words, can you prove to someone that you will be able to walk straight into their office and do £20+ an hours worth of work without saying "trust me - I know what I'm doing"?

That's a whole lot of negatives but if you're smart you'll see where it's leading - you need to put a lot of thought into this and if you decide that this is really what you want to do at any cost, you need to do it properly and that means coughing up for courses and exams. It may also mean taking a lesser job with a suitable company just to get relevent work experience and some in-house training. Depending on your personal circumstances, you may be able to get some help from the DWP or your local authority but it's far from automatic and you may need to pay out a few thousand in order to get the qualifications you'll need at the same time as not having any income or benefits.

I don't know your personal situation - not even your age or current/previous experience or qualifications - so it's hard to say whether you should go for a full-time course or take a bit longer and study in your spare time but either way, the single most important decision when chosing a course is the value of the qualification. Choising a less popular speciality means fewer vacancies but it also mean less competition. If you want to be able to walk into a job fairly easily, you need to look at way more than a single software package - especially one as limited as sharepoint. I'm not commenting on the quality of the product - just the potential market for people who can use it. With sich a niche product, you also have to ask yourself - "what will I do if the product itself disappeared tomorrow?"

When I started learning IT, the choices for business were the likes of COBOLand FORTRAN and when home computing took off, BASIC. Schools and colleges churned out a whole generation of kids who could write a Pacman clone on a ZX Spectrum but when they actually got a job and had to actually use computer, they were lost. It got even worse when PC clones pretty-well replaced the old home computers and knowing a bunch of peeks and pokes was completely useless - people were and still are more likely to want help getting basic hardware to work than in printing their name twenty times in a FOR-NEXT loop.

My best advice for an enthusiast looking to work in IT is to suggest that they start with a basic short course -preferably at a college rather than the local school. Apart from getting some recognised training (maybe even a qualification) you could use the opportunity to talk to the lecturer and see what he/she thinks. They will be best able to give you practical advice based on seeing you current skills and they'll have a far better understanding - and practical knowledge - of the competition and local market. He'll also be able to tell exactly what qualifications employers are looking for and what courses and sub-courses would be best for you - he may suggest that you bypass some and concentrate on others. In the meantime, cram as much as you can on the boring stuff - Windows, Office apps, networking and basic hardware - because you'll be massively improving your chances of finding some relevent temp workif you need it while you are studying. Get yourself at least the minimum qualifications you can without paying a lot of money - the European licence and RSA's or similar will be enough to get you on an agency's books or into an interview. NVQ's are useful but they are vocationally specific. Business related NVQs are good as they cover transferable skills but you really need to look at qualifications that prove your worth in your chosen career.

A long post I know but I could quite easily have typed ten times that amount. The bottom line is that you need to think a bit more about how and a bit less about why. It's entirely do-able as long as you set realistic targets and plan for the financial and other costs - including the effect it can have on your social and private life. Get professional advice - even tap up the IT gnomes where you currently work - to see if there is a realistic chance of making a living for the rest of your life if you follow your chosen path. Even if you do qualify and get work, you must never stop learning and looking aound to see what'shot and what's not - who knows what skills will be required in ten years time and it's often the specialists who fall behind the fastest because they are out of the loop. A more generalised approach will usually mean lower wages in the short-term but a much longer career and more opportunities for advancement in the medium to long term - it also offers a far greater chance of an employer providing or paying for training to keep you up to date.

For the record, I previously worked for the Department of Works and Pensions, ran my own businesses, managed a number of other businesses and more recently worked as a training officer for a private company operating on government contracts. I'm not an IT specialist - just a hobbyist - but I've been studying and working with computers since 1978 and I've seen a hell of a lot of changes in the IT industry. I'm drawing on all of those elements in this post.